No. I did have a difficult time getting it tuned until i raised it up some. I'll try to locate the info on the previous antenna.
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5/8 wave @ 37'
- Thread starter HomerBB
- Start date
Did you have any plans to change the matching network to the Maco V-58 type? Y'know; the loop with the wire attachment point? Just curious, since you pretty much have the same antenna otherwise . . .
Hey, Robb.
It does, in fact, have the wire tap point on the ring from the center coax conductor.
It does, in fact, have the wire tap point on the ring from the center coax conductor.
Robb, I'm not positive what he did about the wire tap point but he did say he used the idea for the Cushcraft AR10/Ringo for dimensions and to resemble the V58 Maco.
If you look closely at the ring in the second photo in the start of this thread you can see the tap wire on the ring.
The only difference between this antenna and the previous model on the same frame is the traditional spring type inductor and the loop ring. Both are/were tapped from the center coax conductor.
The only difference between this antenna and the previous model on the same frame is the traditional spring type inductor and the loop ring. Both are/were tapped from the center coax conductor.
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@Marconi
I searched for photos of the analyzer readings for the previous antenna in the photo above, but could not locate them. I finally remembered I built it during the period when my MFJ-259B was broken and I had to rely on just a SWR meter.
However, I do have some readings from another 5/8 wave I made. When I take the reading I am either directly attached to the antenna, or else I use an e1/2λ coax jumper between the antenna and the analyzer.
I searched for photos of the analyzer readings for the previous antenna in the photo above, but could not locate them. I finally remembered I built it during the period when my MFJ-259B was broken and I had to rely on just a SWR meter.
However, I do have some readings from another 5/8 wave I made. When I take the reading I am either directly attached to the antenna, or else I use an e1/2λ coax jumper between the antenna and the analyzer.
That is the antenna that the analyzer readings were taken.
I have no answer for large bandwidth when the readings are taken with a e1/2λ jumper.
I will say that I usually use a slightly larger average diameter than most antennas. The tubing I can get locally will result in only 3 sizes of tubing - 1", 3/4", 5/8" with a short length of 1/2" at the top end only as necessary. I don't think this accounts for BW.
Other than this antenna not having the aluminum plate on it, the vertical radiator setup is the same with the vertical descending 10" below the radials. It does have the brass toilet ring and a heavy plastic plate.
Bottom of the antenna:
I have no answer for large bandwidth when the readings are taken with a e1/2λ jumper.
I will say that I usually use a slightly larger average diameter than most antennas. The tubing I can get locally will result in only 3 sizes of tubing - 1", 3/4", 5/8" with a short length of 1/2" at the top end only as necessary. I don't think this accounts for BW.
Other than this antenna not having the aluminum plate on it, the vertical radiator setup is the same with the vertical descending 10" below the radials. It does have the brass toilet ring and a heavy plastic plate.
Bottom of the antenna:
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Why does your meter show X=0 as the frequencies change?
Is there a switch on your analyzer that turns the X function off and on?
I have also seen meter responses from others using the MFJ 259 that show the values of X (reactance) change as they scan the frequencies and some that don't, so I don't mean to single you out here.
Below is my Antenna Work Sheet for the first time I scanned my new I-10K. Sorry it is hard to read...I did them in pencil and over the years they have become a bit faint. Try using the zoom button in the PDF file a the top right hand side of the image and click to blow it up a bit using the (+) key...might help.
You will see the Z in my report as the last line in the scan details.
Is there a switch on your analyzer that turns the X function off and on?
I have also seen meter responses from others using the MFJ 259 that show the values of X (reactance) change as they scan the frequencies and some that don't, so I don't mean to single you out here.
Below is my Antenna Work Sheet for the first time I scanned my new I-10K. Sorry it is hard to read...I did them in pencil and over the years they have become a bit faint. Try using the zoom button in the PDF file a the top right hand side of the image and click to blow it up a bit using the (+) key...might help.
You will see the Z in my report as the last line in the scan details.
It doesn't always appear as X=0.
I believe you asked this question before, so I plotted the measurements with the MFJ259b several ways;
With a coax cut to six electrical 1/2 wavelengths long
With a single electrical 1/2 wavelength jumper
With a 2' long jumper
And with the analyzer directly attached to the antenna feedpoint
I believe you asked this question before, so I plotted the measurements with the MFJ259b several ways;
With a coax cut to six electrical 1/2 wavelengths long
With a single electrical 1/2 wavelength jumper
With a 2' long jumper
And with the analyzer directly attached to the antenna feedpoint
IMO, Homer's radiator is about 13" too short. Seems a typical full 5/8 usually sports about 22' 4" of active radiator.
_________________
So I just ran an swr chase and saw a 2:1 swr at 26.740 & 28.360 on the 3-radial custom Penetrator, based on the old-school 1975 Penetrator-500, so real close to the typical 1.6MHz @ 2:1 swr bandwidth I've seen from the rest of my 4-radial Penetrators over the years.
The radiator of my best performing .64 so far was electrically 273.5" from upper ring arm junction to tip, and the ring-match was OEM for the Maco V58 plus 3/4 turn (270°) added to the top of the one-turn (360°) Maco ring, and the upper ring support arm was bent down to full horizontal.
I'm straining my memory to recall the 3/8" ring diameter but it seems it's about 11.5",
- whatever the factory Maco ring diameter was.
I added 30" of 1.125" tubing to the bottom of the original Maco radiator 1" diameter radiator bottom tube, and which I slid down inside the 30" piece, about 4"
plus
I removed all the radiator tubing from down inside the mounting base and slid a 12" long piece of 1" solid fiberglass rod down inside the mounting base about 5", to insulate & support the 273.5" radiator (1.125" x 30", 1" x 44", 7/8" x 44", 3/4" x 44", 5/8" x 44", 1/2" x 67.5" (*64.5") ).
I set the radials to 106" plus the 2" or so of hub, so 108" total.
The tap point was almost exactly 180° around the ring-match, from the beginning of the lower ring support arm.
So Marconi, I hope that gives you enough to work with, and I believe the radials were 3.5" below the lower ring support arm.
It will be interesting to see the gain & TOA model.
*That's the radiator electrical measurement, not the true physical measurement, the physical measurement is 270.5" but I don't know how your modeling looks at an average of about a .85" average diameter radiator - along with the VF of aluminum in air of .9979
BTW, I just bought a new phone today, so I now have a working camera, (which died on the old phone) so I'll take a new set of pics of the Penetrator matching rods for you, Eddie.
_________________
So I just ran an swr chase and saw a 2:1 swr at 26.740 & 28.360 on the 3-radial custom Penetrator, based on the old-school 1975 Penetrator-500, so real close to the typical 1.6MHz @ 2:1 swr bandwidth I've seen from the rest of my 4-radial Penetrators over the years.
The radiator of my best performing .64 so far was electrically 273.5" from upper ring arm junction to tip, and the ring-match was OEM for the Maco V58 plus 3/4 turn (270°) added to the top of the one-turn (360°) Maco ring, and the upper ring support arm was bent down to full horizontal.
I'm straining my memory to recall the 3/8" ring diameter but it seems it's about 11.5",
- whatever the factory Maco ring diameter was.
I added 30" of 1.125" tubing to the bottom of the original Maco radiator 1" diameter radiator bottom tube, and which I slid down inside the 30" piece, about 4"
plus
I removed all the radiator tubing from down inside the mounting base and slid a 12" long piece of 1" solid fiberglass rod down inside the mounting base about 5", to insulate & support the 273.5" radiator (1.125" x 30", 1" x 44", 7/8" x 44", 3/4" x 44", 5/8" x 44", 1/2" x 67.5" (*64.5") ).
I set the radials to 106" plus the 2" or so of hub, so 108" total.
The tap point was almost exactly 180° around the ring-match, from the beginning of the lower ring support arm.
So Marconi, I hope that gives you enough to work with, and I believe the radials were 3.5" below the lower ring support arm.
It will be interesting to see the gain & TOA model.
*That's the radiator electrical measurement, not the true physical measurement, the physical measurement is 270.5" but I don't know how your modeling looks at an average of about a .85" average diameter radiator - along with the VF of aluminum in air of .9979
BTW, I just bought a new phone today, so I now have a working camera, (which died on the old phone) so I'll take a new set of pics of the Penetrator matching rods for you, Eddie.
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@Needle Bender
The notes I made say I used the radiator length I posted, however, I can't recall whether I lengthened it to get a better match or not. If i did I didn't write it down.
Climate is too wet, and windy to bring it down and check it now.
The notes I made say I used the radiator length I posted, however, I can't recall whether I lengthened it to get a better match or not. If i did I didn't write it down.
Climate is too wet, and windy to bring it down and check it now.
Thank you guys for taking my questions.
NB here are some of the V58 dimensions I see in the manual, Rev 2/10, or else I just took a guess. I don't own a V58.
The hoop radius on the V58 is determined by bracket part P08P and is 5.5" x 0.50" x 0.125" inches. This part is made up of the bracket, SO239, and the wire.
The other bracket part R02P is 7.75"........ inches and it slants up to connect to the base assembly part of the radiator at the top of BA1P.
I don't know how long the base assembly BA1P is...as it comes in the kit, but I've guessed it to be approximately 57" inches overall and maybe a bit more.
I think BA1P is preassembled and is not adjustable as to the overall length. If one needs to adjust the radiator length then the element T43P above BA1P will need to be adjusted up or down. T43P is noted to be 48" inches long and is set 6" inches inside BA1P to allow for adjustments.
The manual says to adjust the radiator length at the point of the element in the top of part BA1P as noted in my comments above.
There is a big bold note for this adjustment point on page 5, where the whole antenna is imaged and the parts are referenced by number.
There are more dimensions I have questions on, but right now my model with the manuals dimensions is showing the radiator to be very short and needing more inductive reactance...no matter where I put the tap point on the 35" inch long tuning coil.
Does anyone know the overall length of BA1P and the location of the spider hub RO3P?
Homer is your radiator glued into the pvc in the base of your antenna?
NB here are some of the V58 dimensions I see in the manual, Rev 2/10, or else I just took a guess. I don't own a V58.
The hoop radius on the V58 is determined by bracket part P08P and is 5.5" x 0.50" x 0.125" inches. This part is made up of the bracket, SO239, and the wire.
The other bracket part R02P is 7.75"........ inches and it slants up to connect to the base assembly part of the radiator at the top of BA1P.
I don't know how long the base assembly BA1P is...as it comes in the kit, but I've guessed it to be approximately 57" inches overall and maybe a bit more.
I think BA1P is preassembled and is not adjustable as to the overall length. If one needs to adjust the radiator length then the element T43P above BA1P will need to be adjusted up or down. T43P is noted to be 48" inches long and is set 6" inches inside BA1P to allow for adjustments.
The manual says to adjust the radiator length at the point of the element in the top of part BA1P as noted in my comments above.
There is a big bold note for this adjustment point on page 5, where the whole antenna is imaged and the parts are referenced by number.
There are more dimensions I have questions on, but right now my model with the manuals dimensions is showing the radiator to be very short and needing more inductive reactance...no matter where I put the tap point on the 35" inch long tuning coil.
Does anyone know the overall length of BA1P and the location of the spider hub RO3P?
Homer is your radiator glued into the pvc in the base of your antenna?
The radiator is set in the PVC with silicone at the top, and centeted with non-conducting spacer in the bottom.
It is never in contact with the mounting bracket, nor any other metal, except where the ring mounting bracket contacts it.
It is never in contact with the mounting bracket, nor any other metal, except where the ring mounting bracket contacts it.