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MARS Radio volunteering

Dale Ferrier

Member
Jan 28, 2016
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I was looking into applying to be a MARS volunteer but one of the questions on the application has the following:
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Is your station capable of transmitting and receiving using a approved data waveform?(Such waveforms include MIL-STD 188-110A Serial PSK, Wide Shift FSK (RTTY), Olivia, MT63 and Pactor)
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So what is all that stuff?

I have a Yaesu 857D and I do not see any of that mentioned anywhere (at least anywhere I have looked so far).

BTW, if your interested the application is here:

https://www.txarmymars.org/downloads/TXMARS-Application-2014.pdf

Dale
 

Oh boy........you are a real newbie I guess. Those modes are computer generated and are fed into your radios data port and transmitted using SSB mode. As far as I know most amateur radios now do NOT meet MARS technical requirements for frequency stability unless they have the precision crystal oscillator option. That right there may preclude you from being a member.
 
Oh boy........ as I know most amateur radios now do NOT meet MARS technical requirements for frequency stability unless they have the precision crystal oscillator option...

just for grins,.... I have NO desire too join MARS, I went to their site and looked for info on required equipment. couldn't find anything except the ability to operate from 2 to 30 MHz, and a reference to the Mil Spec, which has nothing to do with freq stability.


they DO want to know if you are a terrorist tho:giggle:
 
Well I am a newbie... :)

So those are all encryption standards? It would have been nice for them to have mentioned that fact or at least that a computer is also required to do those things.

And perhaps they do say so somewhere and I just missed it.

And I am not at all sure I want to volunteer to be a MARs operator either but thought I would look into it anyway. :)
 
No offense Dale but this is a great example of how the exam standards have slipped. Any licensed amateur should at leazt know permissible modes he can operate. Those modes are nothing special and amateurs have been using rtty forever long before computers were around using surplus teletype machines. Again no offense since the sliding of the standards is not your fault. It would just be nice if newbies hitting the air at least knew what modes and frequencies they were authorized to use. And before you ask YES I did have to walk up hill both ways thru waist deep snow to write my exam. :p
 
I was in the process of joining Navy MARS in 2006 when a divorce curtailed that plan. I will say that is isn't as simple as buying a radio and joining up. There was a training manual about 2 inches thick they sent me and there was a certain time frame that you had to meet the training requirements. During the training period they assign you a temporary MARS call sign with a "T" at the end (to designate a trainee) and you are expected to check in to so many nets per week to learn the ropes. It was definitely a commitment.

Since MARS was about to fold some years age I'm not sure how their requirements have changed but I can understand why they added all the digital modes.
 
Frequency stability is just what your radio does, they do not dive into anymore than that.
download fldigi for those digital modes, they are all there except m110-a, which when accepted you can go download It off the web page, and shows you how to set it up.
or someone will help you. The study guide will take you maybe a few days to answer or if slower a week.
They pass message traffic and all is encoded now via another program. They work for DOD, and homeland security. Quiet interesting.

Your yaesu 857d has to be modified for MARS it is on the internet, believe it is a removal of a diode. Also if you never operated digital you need a TNC, signal link is one I run around $115.
That is the story on MARS..
DOCTOR/795
 
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I have run various PSK modes and rtty without a TNC. I assume you mean other digital modes like Olivia etc require a TNC. Most all digital modes now are generated via the computer sound card and transmitted in SSB mode. Never owned a TNC so not too sure about the requirements of needing one. Running PSK RTTY and SSTV never required one.
 
Frequency stability is just what your radio does, they do not dive into anymore than that.
download fldigi for those digital modes, they are all there except m110-a, which when accepted you can go download It off the web page, and shows you how to set it up.
or someone will help you. The study guide will take you maybe a few days to answer or if slower a week.
They pass message traffic and all is encoded now via another program. They work for DOD, and homeland security. Quiet interesting.

Your yaesu 857d has to be modified for MARS it is on the internet, believe it is a removal of a diode. Also if you never operated digital you need a TNC, signal link is one I run around $115.
That is the story on MARS..
DOCTOR/795

Thanks doc and Ratso.

Wow sounds like a lot. I did the mod to increase my freqs, but wasn't sure about the rest especially the mil spec stuff.

You guys answered those questions. I don't expect I will ever volunteer for Mars if they require all that digital stuff.

I am just not all that interested in digital anything (at least not right now).

Dale
 
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I was an Air Force MARS operator in the late 1980s through 1994. At least till the local Air Force base closed!
Very rigorous format to follow, all strict rules and very much a controlled by the NET master. MARS = Military Affiliated Radio Station, usually made up of amateur radio operators and controlled by a set controller. Basically a message service but in times of emergency or war, a backup means to handle communications traffic. Mostly phone or CW but digital modes are becoming an important means of traffic handling.
I am not sure of the frequency tolerance for using amateur radio equipment but most of today's modern rigs are well suited for MARS operation. Digital modes require a better degree of stability so a transceiver should be more exact as far as frequency stability. Digital modes can be better at communication in poor conditions or low propagation than voice and seems to be replacing CW for the most part.
Today's digital modes are becoming more difficult with digital encryption and monthly code changes. With the terrorist threat making it more complex.

73 Rod KB8DNS one time AFA1ZM
 
OK I did a little more digging and found out some more info. There was a lot of discussion regarding NTIA compliance for MARS a few years back. Some hams even went and upgraded their HF rigs with the high stability crystals to be in compliance with the then published CAP acceptance list of acceptable transceivers. I think when MARS realized that they would lose most of their membership if compliance was mandated they backed off the requirement.At this time there are NO amateur transceivers that comply with the technical requirements of CAP. As a side note, at a MARS conference a few years back it was noted that the NTIA mandate was more to accommodate digital modes and the specifications affected the receivers more than the transmitters. At this time most amateur HF radios are compliant for use on MARS. None are compliant with CAP. You gotta forgive me for getting things mixed up. After all I am not in the USA but I do try and keep up with rule and tech spec changes down there. :D
 
I have run various PSK modes and rtty without a TNC. I assume you mean other digital modes like Olivia etc require a TNC. Most all digital modes now are generated via the computer sound card and transmitted in SSB mode. Never owned a TNC so not too sure about the requirements of needing one. Running PSK RTTY and SSTV never required one.
Some newer transceivers are equipped with an internal sound card.
The Signalink or Rascal etc. is used to reduce the audio level of the output level of the computer and the output level of the radios audio circuit.
Radios like the 857D - or ShackInABox - are not good performers on digital modes.
They tend to get hot and burn up.
The OP would also need at least a General Class Amateur Radio License.
My only advice would be to find an Elmer.
The investment would also involve antennas designed to operate on the MARS frequencies, using a 857D and antenna tuner would be like trying to run marathons with sneakers bought from Walmart. Olivia 8-500 and some other modes are very slow. Their advantage is that they do not use a lot of bandwidth..
 
OK I did a little more digging and found out some more info. There was a lot of discussion regarding NTIA compliance for MARS a few years back. Some hams even went and upgraded their HF rigs with the high stability crystals to be in compliance with the then published CAP acceptance list of acceptable transceivers. I think when MARS realized that they would lose most of their membership if compliance was mandated they backed off the requirement.At this time there are NO amateur transceivers that comply with the technical requirements of CAP. As a side note, at a MARS conference a few years back it was noted that the NTIA mandate was more to accommodate digital modes and the specifications affected the receivers more than the transmitters. At this time most amateur HF radios are compliant for use on MARS. None are compliant with CAP. You gotta forgive me for getting things mixed up. After all I am not in the USA but I do try and keep up with rule and tech spec changes down there. :D
The Kenwood TS 590S and SG will perform to their tolerance level - right out of the box.
Using FLDIGI - there is no set standard for tolerance as long as the transceiver is of a modern design. The way that it works, when you have the RXID / TXID turned on, when the originating station executes a transmission, a tone is set out beforehand, and all of the computers locks onto that tone. It basically adjusts all of the computers so everyone is on the same frequency. The radio can be high or low and yet on the waterfall -the computer can still lock onto it. The thing is - if the net takes place say on 7.070.5 and will meet on 1500 on the waterfall - you need to be on frequency so that when the net starts everyone is locked onto the same signal.
This pretty much eliminates old junk - like a Kenwood TS 520 / 530 - that doesn't have a digital display to this resolution, or is not stable enough to be on frequency or stay on frequency.
Each time someone transmits, a warbly sound is made and this adjusts everyone else's computer to where the originating stations computer and transceiver is at on the waterfall.
I bitched about this until finally I just stopped participating all together.
The little box at the bottom tells you where you are tuned, and yet these old farts didn't know how to tune or adjust so everyone was on 1500 and the tune jumped all over the screen because these bung holes were old and didn't know what they were doing..
The other big deal was that FLDIGI is an open source code, which means it can be edited by everyone using it. The version changed weekly, and there was no automatic updates. You basically had to delete the old version and download the new version.
Many times there was mistakes in the code and the newer version did not work until someone fixed it. All you had to do was miss an updated version and a bunch of guys would be down your throat telling you that you are using the wrong version.
It all turned into a pissing match of a bunch of hams that were all trying to impress each other with how smart they were and how they could come up with idea's to make things better, while ignoring that not everyone is a computer programmer.
Computer programmers are weird. They have their own language and humor.
Think - Big Bang Theory and Sheldon!
 

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