Heil Sound Microphones......

[WX2MIG]

After spending close to 4 months now on the HF bands, and hearing just about every rig and microphone made in the last 70 years, it seems to me (anyway) that the best sounding rigs I have personally heard all have a Heil microphone attached. Some were boom mic's on headsets, and some were free standing mic's like the Classic, the Gold Line (GM), or the HM-10 Dual element.

Now I've always gotten good audio reports with my D-104, but like many ham's, I'm always looking for ways to improve my sound and signal.
I've been trolling the Heil website, and also fleBay for Heil mic's, had a bid in on a dual element Goldline, some guy got it new a few years ago, but never used it. The auction ended long after I hit the sack last night, and needless to say I lost, but I wasn't about to bid any higher as it was already approaching the cost of one new from HRO......

Anyway....does anyone here use, or have used a Heil microphone on any of their rigs, and if so....what did you think of it.......?
What model and element did you use......?

 

[Moleculo]

I use the Heil Goldline GM-5 mic. It has a narrow and a wide setting. Since I use it primarily on SSB, I mostly use the narrow setting. However, I'm also running it into the W2IHY audio gear to widen it back up a bit. Sometimes when I feel like messing it with it, I switch to the wide setting, but then I have to change my EQ settings.

Anyway, the Goldline is a good bang-for-the-buck mic. I don't really like the HC-4 element...it's really narrow.

 

[190]

I used a icm (icom only) heil mic on a 756 pro 2 till i sold the radio. no pre amps or processors needed. got nothing but flowers on it. im going to try it on my 706mk2g when we get some conditions. ive heard the others you mention on the air to and all sound great.

 

[W5LZ]

I find that the HC-5 element is about the best I've found. It's 'normally' wide, not pinched up like the HC-4. It makes people sound like they really sound, not 'processed' like bologna or potted meat. Which I figure is how it ought to be.
I've had the same element for quite a few years. Moved it from this housing to that housing depending on what i had at the time. After looking at the new prices, I wish I'd bought a dozen of them when I got this one! I like 'boom' mics. The old BM-10(?) was one of the best Bob Heil made. The newer ones/styles are not as durable, then again I'm rough on them anyway. Oh well...
- 'Doc

 

[WR0220]

I use the GM4 dual element running through an ART V3 Studio preamp into my IC-7000 and frequently get positive comments on the audio quality it produces. I use the full range element for general rag chewing and switch to the HC4 element when DXing. I also use an iCM with my 756 Pro II and it also receives positive comments. I'm quite satisfied with the performance of both mics.

 

[SR385]

Just remember, you can only pass the audio passband that your TX filters and carrier point offset will permit.

The same goes for hearing people too. You can only hear as wide as your filters permit you to.

Too many people put too much money and effort into 'improving' the audio of a rig that is incapable of passing the ranges where it would be noticed. Also too many people are too quick to judge that ESSB audio is 'overrated' when they are only listening to it in 2.4k of pass band.

It's never as simple as a microphone.

It starts with the voice.

Microphone has some effect as it will color for better or worse the original input... the voice.

EQ has some effect again, as it can color for better or worse the signal that exists after the voice and microphone combination.

Processing, compression, noise gating, downward expansion will put the icing on the cake if all the previous components are optimized. Or again, this stage can kill the overall effect.

Remember, hams are not audio engineers. Most who think they are don't even understand the basic concepts, evident by hyper boosting frequencies and misaligning the gain staging of their input chain.

So until you know the actual skill and knowledge level of the person whose audio you are listening to, you don't even have 20% of the total story.

There are guys with thousands of dollars in equipment for audio processing that sound like garbage, but it's not the fault of the equipment....it's the user.

I've worked in sound engineering full time, doing tours and club and other venue work. It isn't simple. Running an HF rig is far simpler. Lots and lots of misinformation out there with regards to audio on the bands.

If I had to say the most common mistake that people make to the detriment of their audio, it would be running too much drive in the mic gain stage. Don't run a processor until it is immediately audible, it will only bring in more background noise and trash and make your voice less intelligible. Run your mic gain until you see 2/3 to 3/4 of your ALC range indicated. Running hotter than that will flatten out your audio and make it sound dead and unnatural.

 

[WX2MIG]

SR385.....

I fully understand and agree with everything you said. I too have dabbled in sound engineering, but my experience was very basic, and at an amateur level.
Played guitar for several years, I sucked at it, but played it all the same.
Purchased a Tascam recorder and a bunch of Shure instrument & vocal mic's, and started playing around with sound recording in my garage. Then put it to use at my buddy's house recording his band. I found out just how difficult it is to reproduce a good quality recording, especially with inexpensive rudimentary equipment.

Now as an amateur radio operator I again have inexpensive rudimentary equipment with an old Kenwood TS-130S, my goal is to make that rudimentary transceiver sound the best it is capable of sounding without spending more for a microphone than the radio itself cost. Many of the microphones offered by Bob Heil are in a decent price range from just under $100.00 to approx $175.00. Of course he also has a few high end models like the Classic, the Heritage, the Fin, the PR-40, and PR-781, I certainly wouldn't invest in a microphone that lists for $245.00, plus whatever the cable and stand would cost, but a microphone that lists for $128.00 to $145.00, and I already have the stand to accommodate it, assuming that microphone gives me some level of improved audio over the pre-amplified D-104, I would invest in that......

As for the elements, the HC-5 and Broadcast elements are engineered for a full rich sounding voice, the HC-4 element was engineered to help your voice cut through pile up's and DX'ing, Bob Heil even admits the fact that the HC-4 is not a good sounding element, but it wasn't ment to be, it was designed to get you heard at long distances on cluttered frequencies.
Being a casual DX'er who avoids pile ups, who spends the vast majority of his hamming on state side rag chews, I have no real need for the HC-4, but the broadcast element and the HC-5 I think would work for me, just wish I could borrow one and try it first before buying one only to find out it doesn't out perform the old D-104 I'm now using.......

 

[Moleculo]

BTW, you could always try an HC-5 element in your D104

 

[W5LZ]

I think SR385 has hit on something that no too many people realize, that 'broadcast' quality microphone may have a range of daylight to dark, but 1, who needs it, and 2, the radio's filters prevent you from utilizing that frequency response range anyway. If you tailor the filters to match that mic, oooo are you gonna be wide! Hope you like complaints.

WX2MIG, if you particularly like that D-104 mic housing, why not try a Hc-5 in it. That element will 'fit' into almost anything, sort of. Or just tape it onto a pencil and hold it between your fingers?
Big difference between entertainment audio and communications audio.
- 'Doc

 

[WX2MIG]

WX2MIG, if you particularly like that D-104 mic housing, why not try a Hc-5 in it. That element will 'fit' into almost anything, sort of.


Big difference between entertainment audio and communications audio.
- 'Doc

Doc...
Heil makes a replacement element for the D-104, but it's engineered to work with Icom radios, not Kenwood....

You are right, there is a big difference between entertainment and communications audio, and Bob Heil knows that, he not only does sound engineering for the entertainment business, but the man is also a HAM, and designs a line of microphones just for amateur radio.
You should check out his website, there's some interesting information there..... Heil Sound Home

 

[SR385]

Without an EQ or other processing, the GM-5 with the wide band element and the '5' element is a good starting place for a generic stock radio with no mods. Allows you to switch between a full range element and one that has a peak in it for intelligibility without being obnoxious. This mic sounds nice on most rigs for general use. It has a small PTT switch in it, though you may quickly find that tiny button annoying.

Without adding filter mods to your radio, you could go the route of the W2IHY-Improve microphone transmit audio quality! Defeat RFI, background noise! Equalizers, Noise Gates! 8-bander EQ and something much less expensive like the Audio Technica ATR-30 or the Behringer XM8500. This combination IMO gives the maximum flexibility as it will permit you to EQ according to not only your voice, but allow you to change around with some practice for a sharper audio quality or a mellower audio quality. If you go this route, you will need to wire a momentary spst switch to a cable with an RCA jack on the end for push to talk to key your rig.

A desk mic that can be had for cheap if you wait until you find one on ebay is the Shure 522. I have a few of those kicking around. The only thing with them is, they are meant for talking about 3" on center of the head of the mic. They are noise cancelling and have a narrow pickup pattern as a result. They are awesome if you have a noisy QTH and have nice response if you are disciplined and work them as they are intended. I got my pair of them for $80 or so as a package on ebay used. They are very common for use with PA systems so there are a lot of them around.

I wouldn't recommend many other mics than these frankly and I've been through a lot of combinations....

If you really get diseased, you may wind up running something like the CAD M-177 mic with a Symetrix 528e audio strip....which is how far I've fallen Whatever you do, don't buy that Symetrix new...find one used for $200 and you're in business.

I have the background to fill a rack with gear and have it on the air in a matter of minutes. Do I think it is necessary or even rational to do this for ham radio....no. Is it yet another part of the tinkering with gear that I do for fun in the hobby? You bet.

Oh...yet one more option, if you are a computer type and can feed a mic into a computer and get the audio back out and handle the PTT keying on your own.... Free software called Voice Shaper DX Atlas: Amateur Radio software This software is amazing, but will require your computer to be running to even use the radio. I've run this as well .

 

[SR385]

Oh and btw, I was on my way out the door and not set up to TX, but you were talking to my buds that were just fooling around with the FT-950 and the D104. Dave will not steer you wrong with audio setup.

 

[W5LZ]

The only thing stopping you from putting an Hc-5 (for Kenwood) in a D-104 is making a thingy to hold the element in place. The audio lines and the PTT lines are there, they just have to be reconfigured a tad bit. No amplification/processing is required at all. The only part of the whole thing to be careful with is soldering to the mic element, don't get carried away with it .
ol'EID' and I have been aware of each other for some time. Like most discriminating people, we both wiped our hands after shaking them... I think, can't remember that far back. I hesitate to say we're friends, but we ain't enemies. Which is neither here nor there, and doesn't mean a thing anyway.
I think he makes one or two very nice microphones. And like any other manufacturer, I think he also makes some that are totally useless to me.
- 'Doc

Hey, I have a bad reputation to maintain! Saying I know someone like this ain't doing it a bit of good, so I quit.

 

[RickC.]

Try a plain-jane SM-57 and a small mixer (Behringer, Mackie)-- I did that for quite a while with my old TS-520 and my IC-718. It worked very well, and having 3 band EQ helps. I used one of the Shure screw-on pop filters, but anything that fits will work, of course.

Mics I experimented with in that configuration besides the '57 were the SM-58, Beta-57, SM-81, BG-4, Oktava 105, SM-7, and EV-635. For my voice, the SM-57 was clearly the best, beating out even the condensers. Having two rigs and being able to record off-the-air audio showed some dramatic differences in the mics sometimes for this use.

I finally got tired of dealing with all that and went back to the MC-50 for the Kenwood and alternate on the Icom between a reworked D-104 (with a Radio Shack condenser element in the head) and a Heil ICM. The ICM is OK, but nothing spectacular. If I decide not to sell it I'll probably replace it with the same Radio Shack capsule that's in the D-104.

I just recently ordered an Astatic 878DM, we'll see how that works with the Icom (which needs a mic with a preamp- the ICM's output is fairly low).


Rick

 

[EDUK8TR]

I have a HC-5 element in a D-104 and always get good audio reports on it. Recently I decided that I wanted to try a headset on both my 706 in the mobile and on my TS-2000 on base employing VOX. I bought the adapters and one headset from W2ENY. http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3rys4/single_headset_mod/ I already had a another labtec headset that I used with voice recognition software that Im using on base which is a full headset. The monorail headset I use in the mobile for obvious reasons.:blink: I ran an on air test with the TS-2000 with both the D-104/HC-5 and the labtec mikes and the results were that it was hard to tell the difference between them. I also didn't have to change any of the EQ settings on the 2000, they both sounded very close in the TX monitor.

In the mobile setup I was told that there was a major difference between the stock mike of the 706 and the labtec headset with the headset being preferred over the stock mike every time. I prefer to use the headset while mobile but there is a difference in the delay and anti-VOX settings for FM and SSB. So I usually use the PTT switch while on FM and use VOX while on HF SSB to keep from having to enter a menu to make the necessary changes.

The HC-5 elements sound great and the D-104 conversion is simple and easy to complete. I'm sure the HC-5 can be used in just about any other mike by switching out the elements. As with many modifications your results may vary. Isn't that part of the fun of playing with these radios and their miriad of accessories!:w00t: