-
You can now help support WorldwideDX when you shop on Amazon at no additional cost to you! Simply follow this Shop on Amazon link first and a portion of any purchase is sent to WorldwideDX to help with site costs.
metal antennas vs fiberglass ears
- Thread starter Bearcat
- Start date
in my case which might be diferent than others,, a 99 antenna was noisy and when i ran a amp would have a buzzing sound in transmit,,,maco v5/8 is quieter in the noise level, can hear contacts which would be down in noise level on 99,, have both up in the air now and use maco more and sometimes use a99 for swl,,,,
Same here. Ran an A99 and it was noisy. Changed it out to a sirio tornado and way less noise. Now running an NV4K. It has some very good ears!! Height is might!! The sirio GM may be the exception to the fiberglass rule as most say they are quiet antennas. I have never owned one so I can't say otherwise. The A99 is an okay antenna. It will get you on air, and make contacts, but they are built in a manner that are prone to failure at some point depending on where you live. FL sun does a number on fiberglass. Antennas are one area that I have finally learned will make or break your radio experience at times. JMHO. And I know very little about antennas other than from my own experiences. A good antenna for dxing that doesn't pick up a lot of noise at all is the simple 1/2 wave dipole hung horizontally. This is what I have found anyway.
I'm getting back into radio after a 5 year layoff...i have ran a 99 and a maco v58....but the maco was a pita to get above 20ft and the stinger kept sliding inside itself...ran it for a few days and the Texas weather finally took it down...lesson learned
It goes without saying that all antennas are metal. It is just some have a fibreglass chassis / kind of radome. I use a Silver Rod, MAX2000 and a Gain Master (The Gain Master only partially enclosed in fibreglass as per this video) :
I would not have thought manufacturers would use fibre glass if it affected performance/noise in any way.
I would guess if noise is an issue it must be some other antenna design factor. I think the MAX2000 is very slightly noisier than my other antennas but it is not anywhere near an S point difference. Maybe 1-2 dB maximum estimated by ear.
There is a tendency to hear and read that Antron99 and Max2000 have higher static or noise floor than other antennas. The GM is reportedly and in practice one of the quietest (in regard to base line RX hiss/static) verticals so it kind of rules out the fibreglass being the noise creating factor. The Antron and MAX are "variable mutual transductance tuned" I will guess this may have the capability of inducing a little more noise ? (coil inside a coil)
It is also the only 5/8 wave vertical of 24 feet length (a true 5/8 wave length at least, in my book) that ships without radials.
Not sure, it is a hunch might be something to do with their "dial-a-match" tuning. (Which has not managed to make any difference to the VSWR for the MAX2000 I have, it has never been below 1.5:1 here in any kind of set up)
I think it might be complicated. The better your vertical antenna is the more noise it will bring in by default as base line RX hiss (and of course wanted radio signals and also unwanted QRM !) This is very apparent when I attach a Sirio HP4000 mag mount to my radio and I have to turn the radio up by 30pct more on the volume knob to hear a similar level of volume (hiss even) to my ears. It suggests a worse antenna is connected, with relatively poor capacitive coupling to ground and likely worse efficiency due to a 2.1M whip and a lossy make up coil. (Still one of the best mobile antennas for 11m)
However there is baseline RX of actual RF noise in the air/radio RX electronics and then maybe antenna design which exacerbates noise/QRM, static pick up for some reason in the radios receiver electronics. Quite complicated when we start to think about what constitutes noise at any given QTH. I think the baseline RX noise floor is a function of the exact radio you own and the antenna system. (and maybe the mains electricity/power situation)
I would not have thought manufacturers would use fibre glass if it affected performance/noise in any way.
I would guess if noise is an issue it must be some other antenna design factor. I think the MAX2000 is very slightly noisier than my other antennas but it is not anywhere near an S point difference. Maybe 1-2 dB maximum estimated by ear.
There is a tendency to hear and read that Antron99 and Max2000 have higher static or noise floor than other antennas. The GM is reportedly and in practice one of the quietest (in regard to base line RX hiss/static) verticals so it kind of rules out the fibreglass being the noise creating factor. The Antron and MAX are "variable mutual transductance tuned" I will guess this may have the capability of inducing a little more noise ? (coil inside a coil)
It is also the only 5/8 wave vertical of 24 feet length (a true 5/8 wave length at least, in my book) that ships without radials.
Not sure, it is a hunch might be something to do with their "dial-a-match" tuning. (Which has not managed to make any difference to the VSWR for the MAX2000 I have, it has never been below 1.5:1 here in any kind of set up)
I think it might be complicated. The better your vertical antenna is the more noise it will bring in by default as base line RX hiss (and of course wanted radio signals and also unwanted QRM !) This is very apparent when I attach a Sirio HP4000 mag mount to my radio and I have to turn the radio up by 30pct more on the volume knob to hear a similar level of volume (hiss even) to my ears. It suggests a worse antenna is connected, with relatively poor capacitive coupling to ground and likely worse efficiency due to a 2.1M whip and a lossy make up coil. (Still one of the best mobile antennas for 11m)
However there is baseline RX of actual RF noise in the air/radio RX electronics and then maybe antenna design which exacerbates noise/QRM, static pick up for some reason in the radios receiver electronics. Quite complicated when we start to think about what constitutes noise at any given QTH. I think the baseline RX noise floor is a function of the exact radio you own and the antenna system. (and maybe the mains electricity/power situation)
Last edited:
to make you long post short,... it is normally called S/N ratio (Signal to Noise)
Interesting that antennas do not have S/N ratios as a specification.
I think we have 2 to contend with in a radio RX. The audio circuitry and the RF circuitry.
Each could be a factor in any given radio. When they give a radio S/N in a manual does it
include both ?
I imagine there is an audio noise floor in the audio circuitry and an RF noise floor in demodulation/RF circuitry. I was trying to walk through my thoughts on the complexity of determining inherent "self noise" of circuitry doing the job it has been designed to do and an RX circuit/antenna system in it's ability to exacerbate noise from sources other than itself. That is going to vary considerably at each QTH and may not be easy to discern which is which.
I find it very interesting. I would have thought S/N ratio was based on RX electronic circuit and antenna. (Arguably one and the same thing but with great variation from set up to set up)
Last edited:
There should be no difference. The only difference should be in bandwidth.
You can't measure signal to noise ratio with an antenna. An antenna merely transports signal and noise received by it, it doesn't generate any of its own unlike a transmitter, the galaxy, the planet, electronic devices, components within those devices.
Last edited:
