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tube watts louder than transistor watts ???

B

BOOTY MONSTER

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ive seen a few post over time where folks have said watts produced from tube amps are louder than watts produced from solid state/transistor amps . they usually refer to "plate modulated audio" as their reason . is there any truth to any of this ? is it just bull crap ? is a watt a watt irregardless of the amp that produces it ?

for example .... would a 1000 watt amp like a ameritron al-80B be louder with a modulated signal than a solid state amp like the yaesu or icom MOSFET amp or a texas star 1600v ? i've also read post where folks say class C watts are louder than class AB watts . im a doubting thomas , but im interested in what the consensus is here ?
also , what is "plate modulated audio" ?
 

Loudness is determined by the percentage of modulation and strength of the signal. If both amps have the same power output and are being fed with a signal with the same modulation level they will be the same volume. The problem with the statement you refer too is it has been confused with the fact that tubes tended to have a richer slightly more mellow and pleasing sound than the first solidstate transmitters. Over the year that has changed unless you are talking about a properly driven tube transmitter/amp versus a crappy class C solidstate amp/transmitter. As for plate modulation, that is where the tubes in the final amp have audio applied to the plate voltage thru a special transformer called a modulation transformer which causes the final tube's plate voltage to fluctuate at he same rate as the audio which in turn changes the output of the tubes. This change in output is what we see on an oscilloscope as a modulated signal.Some old die hards claim that plate modulation is the best but in fact it is the most efficient way to to it when overall power consumption is concerned and that is the reason why commercial broadcast AM transmitters used that method. The RF tubes operated class C and the audio tubes operated class B.
 
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AFAIK plate modulation has a little trouble keeping up with cathode modulation, and the Ameritron should be cathode driven.

But what you are ultimatley refering to is distortion and "percieved" loadness IMO.
 
359 said:
AFAIK plate modulation has a little trouble keeping up with cathode modulation, and the Ameritron should be cathode driven.
But what you are ultimatley refering to is distortion and "percieved" loadness IMO.
Click to expand...


The Ameritron is an amp and has nothing to do with modulation. Also the Ameritron line of amps are cathode driven aka grounded grid. Grid driven amps are preferred if low driving power is all that is available as they can be driven to full output with much lower driving power than a cathode driven amp.
 
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Captain Kilowatt said:
Loudness is determined by the percentage of modulation and strength of the signal. If both amps have the same power output and are being fed with a signal with the same modulation level they will be the same volume. The problem with the statement you refer too is it has been confused with the fact that tubes tended to have a richer slightly more mellow and pleasing sound than the first solidstate transmitters. Over the year that has changed unless you are talking about a properly driven tube transmitter/amp versus a crappy class C solidstate amp/transmitter. As for plate modulation, that is where the tubes in the final amp have audio applied to the plate voltage thru a special transformer called a modulation transformer which causes the final tube's plate voltage to fluctuate at he same rate as the audio which in turn changes the output of the tubes. This change in output is what we see on an oscilloscope as a modulated signal.Some old die hards claim that plate modulation is the best but in fact it is the most efficient way to to it when overall power consumption is concerned and that is the reason why commercial broadcast AM transmitters used that method. The RF tubes operated class C and the audio tubes operated class B.
Click to expand...

525670.jpg
 
Captain Kilowatt said:
The Ameritron is an amp and has nothing to do with modulation. Also the Ameritron line of amps are cathode driven aka grounded grid. Grid driven amps are preferred if low driving power is all that is available as they can be driven to full output with much lower driving power than a cathode driven amp.
Click to expand...
If you'd have read the OP thouroghly, you'd see that Booty was talking about plate modulation, and then referenced and Ameritron amplifier, which is cathode driven.
 
359 said:
If you'd have read the OP thouroghly, you'd see that Booty was talking about plate modulation, and then referenced and Ameritron amplifier, which is cathode driven.
Click to expand...

I am aware of what Booty said.What had me confused a bit was your post "AFAIK plate modulation has a little trouble keeping up with cathode modulation, and the Ameritron should be cathode driven." You mentioned cathode mod and then cathode driven and apparently I misunderstood where you were coming from or going too with it. :oops:
 
You're all full of it. Tubes are 'hollow state' technology and transistors are 'solid state'. That means those tubes are hollow and therefore capable of producing resonant echoes, where solids don't 'echo' at all. Just be sure to place a pan under that grid incase is leaks...
Right?
- 'Doc


(now thats BS!)
 
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Captain Kilowatt said:
I am aware of what Booty said.What had me confused a bit was your post "AFAIK plate modulation has a little trouble keeping up with cathode modulation, and the Ameritron should be cathode driven." You mentioned cathode mod and then cathode driven and apparently I misunderstood where you were coming from or going too with it. :oops:
Click to expand...
Yeah, I did kinda run those two thoughts into one sentence :blush:
 
i have no problem with the conversation getting off track a bit . sometimes it's necessary ...... and typically it's beneficial to getting a better/broader understanding of the original topic/question .

thanks for the comments so far :D
 
W5LZ said:
You're all full of it. Tubes are 'hollow state' technology and transistors are 'solid state'. That means those tubes are hollow and therefore capable of producing resonant echoes, where solids don't 'echo' at all. Just be sure to place a pan under that grid incase is leaks...
Right?
- 'Doc


(now thats BS!)
Click to expand...

can the solid devices be painted to simulate the tubes resonant echo benefit ?
if so what color ?
blue is my favorite and would be a plus (y)
 
Sure paint them a pink color like doc does his wire antennas, pink helps keep the getters inside the hollow tube.

Then you can tell everyone you are getting more watts out of that tube cuz it is getter pink color.:D
 

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