What do the members think about.......

[Handy Andy]

You just hit the crux of this debate...

After the things that were pointed out my solution isn't ideal either but perhaps it will inspire a better one.

... [ ... ] ...

As to "free speech" - as far as I see it my "free speech" only goes as far as what the site administration determines it should be.

What I still hope for is rational discussion.

This is where the defining line gets interesting...

Metaphorical=ON.

It's the catch-phrase...
"When your Rights to Free Speech - impinge upon my Rights not to hear your Free Speech"

Like the car passing with the loud stereo - the boom - boom boom - boom fades away as they pass - only infringes on your rights to peace and quiet if only for a moment.

It's when the car parks itself in front of your driveway and steps out to see someone at the house across the street - leaving the radio on - what do you do.

Tolerate it?

OR buy a Hi-lo and fork the vehicle, pushing it and place it further down the street.

The only excuse you have is they blocked your driveway.

The above is a simple analogy, but shows why laws are in place - to protect ourselves from others as well as ourselves.

Blocking someone is a lot like the car that blocks your driveway. Do you either; tell the person to park somewhere else, requiring you to act quickly - or let it go (Ignore) until you make a phone call to the police and have the vehicle towed, and usually by the time the police show up (Report) - the guy has moved on...So blocking let's the guy posting his carp leaves behind the garbage, but takes something from someone close to you and your ignorance to the situation didn't harm you at the moment but what did you miss?

It's when the guy across the street is found dead after being robbed...because the guy with the loud stereo had the intention of masking the confrontation with noise to "finish the job" "Sopranos" comes to mind. (Toxic) (SPAM)

So, does then the example of the Hi-Lo with the fork to the vehicle - as in; it removes the getaway car and the guy then has to find another means to escape - only survives for a moment until they are to be caught or "removed" themselves. (Delayed, Moderated, Deletion)

So, when you Ignore someone - you have a blinder - a censor. But you also remove yourself from participation in the event of something that can go horribly wrong with your neighbor which you could have lessened the impact. (Report)

When we ignore, we allow parasites to enter. I'm using "parasites" as the metaphor for this. They can produce and proliferate and then the site is no better than the parasite itself. Because the other neighbors that see this happening in front of them, will leave to find safer places to live (post their ideas). You are left in a neighborhood full of parasites that are now feeding themselves with themselves.

Welcome to Google.

:+> Andy <+:

I am so glad someone else is thinking about this...

 

[Riverman]

Lest we forget, this thread was begun in jest.
Despite a lot of good ideas, nothing is going to change. Primarily, as others have pointed out, it would mean more work for Captain who is already mired in a thankless job, bless his heart.

Unless . . . it was a Paid position!
Let's see. There are over 1200 pages of members' names with about 30 per page. That's over 36,000 members. If, conservatively, a tenth of those are still around that's 3,600. If say, 30% of those are willing to pay an annual due of $25 that would come to $27,000 per year. Not bad for a part time job.

That's not going to happen.

For several reasons, but foremost because of what the site's owner, Moleculo, told me long ago in a conversation after I first complained to him and Captain about some members' vulgar language, name-calling and just plain mean-spiritedness. His response was, "Boys will be boys."

Or, as Kopcicle would say, Erunt pueri pueri.

So what we have is what we have. Which really is pretty good. Lot of good folks, lot of smart people, lot of useful information, lot of laughs, lots of good times. And, some not so good. But that's life.

That said, this is my last word on the subject. (thunderous applause) For good.
You all have my word on that.

Besides, I have more pressing matters. Like trying to decide between a MP-1, Tak-tenna or an Isotron.

 

[Tallman]

Free speech? That's a right that no longer exist. If it truly did then John Schnatter would still be the man in charge. Oh wait I forgot free speech does not guarantee a sympatric audience, nor that you will not suffer repercussions for Cerebral Diarrhea.
Excuse me it is time for me to stick another dose of IMMODIUM in my ears.

 

[dave457]

The only problem I see are some people are a little too thin skinned around here

 

[jon666]

yeah not a good idea leave it as it is. but its your decision
in the end

 

[Handy Andy]

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but there is already free advertising in-between the posts.

So unless we redefine the term Spam as far as subjects - some still will feel that they have the "right" to promote their site using links as they see fit. It's already between the lines (messages)

So really it comes down to; should the sites' listed above be banned?

Or, should they be forced to compensate and advertise like the rest of those that have fallen in line, whom did the right thing - and got a chance to promote their wares right in-between our steps on how you should fix/install/rebuilt - a - radio/amp/antenna?

Makes far more sense to force those that wish to advertise or promote to get in line and wait their turn.

Delete the rest that does not promote fair expression or trade.

We just have to have a better definition of it.

:+> Andy <+:

 

[Martian]

The ads that go to fund the site?

With regards to these two groups, and this individual, I see now after several weeks why so many people have come to the conclusions they have.

With all due respect to everyone, I like to come to my own conclusions.
It's not that I don't believe anyone.
I think everyone should do their own "fact checking" and not join a clique or jump onto a bandwagon sight unseen.

I have encountered individuals like these few before. And it serves as a reminder that we have a very poor mental health system and we need to do more to help people like this. They need help.

Trolling is one thing. But even trolls give it a rest. They move on. Change the subject.
This has been going on for nearly a decade continuously, here and on nearly a dozen other forums by the same people.

It's well beyond trolling. It's mental illness.

This is what they do.
day in, and day out.
They force the narrow end of the wedge in.

If you say something good or bad about another shop, that's the narrow end of the wedge. Then it's a post about My guy "Fine Tune CB" or "Snake Radios" is better than yours, or you should have done Y instead of Z

You might just ask about how to tweak something and it turns into ...
"send it to MY GUY!"
"Don't bother learning things for yourself!"
"Your a moron for not sending it to MY GUY!"

 

[543_Dallas]

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but there is already free advertising in-between the posts.

So unless we redefine the term Spam as far as subjects - some still will feel that they have the "right" to promote their site using links as they see fit. It's already between the lines (messages)

So really it comes down to; should the sites' listed above be banned?

Or, should they be forced to compensate and advertise like the rest of those that have fallen in line, whom did the right thing - and got a chance to promote their wares right in-between our steps on how you should fix/install/rebuilt - a - radio/amp/antenna?

Makes far more sense to force those that wish to advertise or promote to get in line and wait their turn.

Delete the rest that does not promote fair expression or trade.

We just have to have a better definition of it.

:+> Andy <+:

Good point. Spam is the word I should have used. Not allowing talk about certain brands or vendors is too extreme. Thats why I no longer post on cbrt. They don't allow talk about anyone that doesn't sponsor the site and certain words are automatically censored from posts. It's hard to discuss anything.

Most of the technical questions answered with "buy this from one of our sponsors." It's difficult to talk about homebrew when the word copper is not allowed.

 

[kaos513]

All i have to say the proof is out there so beware.
.

 

[loosecannon]

maybe this is all Youtube's fault!!!

Just kidding, have a great day to all.
LC

 

[Martian]

Blame YouTube!

This existed long before YouTube.
It goes back a decade, when "Fine Tune" was another truck stop golden screwdriver and "Snake Radios" was dropping AR3500s on the floor.

YouTube did make it much, much worse.
"Fine Tune" is a relative newcomer.
Just the newest shark in the water, that's all.

 

[Shadetree Mechanic]

Tim no longer does work on any base stations.....

 

[Handy Andy]

@ Martian...

So noted!

That's what takes a simpler forum discussion into the realm of Toxic very quickly.

They need to be dealt with quickly succinctly and thoroughly due to the nature of the discussions tends to turn very sour very rapidly.

It is why I asked about the "moderation", a delayed posting of users that simply sign in, hit their targets (drop their bombs) and unless they (new users and their thread) are removed, a rebuttal turns into a rugby match faster than a moderator could respond. We don't have that at the moment.

This may sound like censorship, but look at this from the perspective of a person that wishes to provoke a fight. It is their INTENT to step in and incite, provoke, instill a worm that weaves their way into the forum. They defer, deceive and derail any progress in the thread because their intent was not to provide an answer - but to simply deflate the thought bubble that was forming. Promote another idea at the expense of those that they (these hit-and-run posters) feel are foolish to be so gullible and fall for this every time...It may sound harsh, but again, we need to step out of ourselves and realize the world is not a happy place - it is full of people whom think less, far less of others that don't share their ideals and they take steps into the forum, form their perimeter and they are proven correct far more than not.

The above is censorship - but not in the direct sense - it is another type of expression - used to detract from the original premise and used instead to form a thread of discourse.

This is where they succeed in their attacks - they phish for ideas - generate a diversion, or create an argument and the forum is left to burn thru into ashes of it's former self.

The Moderator, hi.- yes, it's a chore and things have to be done, but to maintain the integrity of the forum and it's ability to provide free thought without harassment - needs to be considered. A reputation? Perhaps that is a word for it, or a haven for those what wish to develop ideas amongst their peers and all that can participate fairly can be involved and benefit from this. I've been in forums that are like a magical land of ideas and thoughts that if left alone can provide it's own form of entertainment and enjoyment if not a garden for those that wish to play with these thought provoking ideas.

IT is why corporations have a "sandbox" of their own for their engineers, technicians and support staff to share ideals, ideas and inspirations - amongst themselves and hidden from the internet and it's in it's own bubble. I'm not asking for a "bubble" just asking for those that are trying to poison the wells of thought that spring up - that they be stopped at the gate and not allowed to tarnish an otherwise spotless site from their deprecations.

:+> Andy <+:

 

[Dmans]

I will still exercise the ignore button when it becomes too much to stomach!

73's
David

 

[Martian]

The ignore button is a perfectly fine thing.

How many are aware of the so-called trash television?
Or remember shows like The Howard Stern Show - not the radio show but the TV show?
Or more recently Maury or Jerry Springer?

I find them repulsive. I think it takes a special sort to watch society implode and for corporations to take advantage of it but at the end of the day I don't have to watch it.

So I change the channel.
The forum is the same way.
If the thread gets to be too much for me to handle I will remove myself from it.

I don't hold a grudge against anyone.
I practice what's called agreeing to disagree and let life continue.

It's called getting old and having really thick skin