11 meter Extended Double Zepp

[HomerBB]

BA, if you are building a 1/2^ dipole you can expect it to do as well as any 1/2^ monopole antenna at the same height. A99, etc, are what you have as comparative antennas.
I have used a vertical dipole many times with good success. My current 11m vertical is a 1/4^ GP.

 

[Boat Anchor 63]

HomerBB,
11m 1/4 wave vertical gp are good antennas.
I used a 106' stainless whip mounted on the roof my car in the early 2000's and it has a awesome signal. Swr of 1.0.1 was achieved from 26.965mHz-27.405mHz. One of my favorite place to park was underneath a old oak tree sitting on top of a hill overlooking the city. At that height I was able to groundwave over 500 miles without skywave propagation conditions.

 

[HomerBB]

BA, thanks for the input. I have the GP because I am looking at other antenna projects on other bands when I have the time, and under the current conditions one 11m antenna is as good as another, especially at optimum heights.
For me, the TOA is at least as important as gain, if not more so.
I get more for my money with a simple little moxon.
Have a good day.

 

[Marconi]

I will stick with a V4k, Astroplane, or 5/8 GP.

Homer, have you ever built a V4K or 5/8 GP for 2 Meters? If so, how did they compare with your 1/4 wave?

 

[HomerBB]

Howdy, Marconi.
Yes. I have built both a 5/8^ GP and a V4k for 2m.
Currently my base 2m vertical is a Jpole, but not for long. I had the V4k up and thought I would rework it to tidy it up and retune for a better match across the band. As for a 1/4^ GP on 2m so far it has proven to be formidable at low heights, ie. 6' from the ground. Neither the 5/8 nor the V4k have done any better at that height. I've not had the 1/4^GP any higher.
The 1/4^ GP I am using currently is for 11m, and is 44' at the feedpoint. It does pretty good so far. Except for some skip to various places I've not talked farther than ~20 miles locally. I don't do much 11m local QSOs.

 

[bob85]

My buddy Nav knocked a vertical dipole up for uhf stood a couple of wavelength off a fiberglass pole ( stripped out a99 ) & choked near the feed-point,
it worked pretty well but folk using shop bought white sticks had better range,

i suggested he try an EDZ to maximise his gain from a simple dipole & gave him a couple of 827 radials for tube,
we talked about how to tune it with a stub & i wished him good luck as he drove off with his two radials & some HomerBB style ideas on what bits of junk he was gluing together when he got home,

he had it built & tuned in a couple of days & it blows the 1/2wave dipole into the weeds, much better than we expected,
he's not playing second fiddle to white stick operators anymore,

i keep thinking about 27mhz version from the broken sirios i have,
problem is i can't get one high enough without guy wires all over the yard, i could only manage 21ft to the base,

at that height an EDZ won't be far enough ahead of shorter antennas at the same tip height to warrant the hassle.

 

[Boat Anchor 63]

HomerBB,
I read that your the Macgyver of antenna's.
Do you think a 11m vertical 1/4 antenna will perform better than a 1/2 wave, 5/8 wave, sloper, extended double zepp, but not a inverted v if its mounted high. I live in a hoa development facility surrounded by mountains and not able to put out a good signal. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[HomerBB]

HomerBB,
I read that your the Macgyver of antenna's.
Do you think a 11m vertical 1/4 antenna will perform better than a 1/2 wave, 5/8 wave, sloper, extended double zepp, but not a inverted v if its mounted high. I live in a hoa development facility surrounded by mountains and not able to put out a good signal. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

BA, it depends on variables I can't know, but as an "in general" answer, I'd say the inverted V dipole high up is not what I would choose if vertical polarization is what I was looking for. Don't be fooled by the idea that an inverted V dipole is vertically polarized. The higher you go the less vertical it tends to be and certainly the less omnidirectional. If dx were my goal it would be one I'd test. The optimum height likely would be at a 1/2 wavelength above the ground.
The 1/4^ GP would likely provide a lower rf pattern against the the horizon as the 1/2^ and 5/8^ would even lower in succeeding degrees.
If your surrounding mountains are truly boxing you in you might try building a 5/8^ GP style antenna but extend the vertical out to 3/4^. You'd get a normally way too high RF pattern, but it might be your ticket out of the mountains.
There is a lot more to be said about antennas, but the only real way to figure it out in a case like yours is experimentation.

A final note. If you want to do radio and are handicapped by the terrain, perhaps looking into getting a general class ham ticket as an answer. NVIS is possible on the lower ham bands and could get you up and over those hills out to ~1000 miles or so. Just a thought.

Now, let me clarify my MacGyver reputation. It refers to my ingenuity with using found materials to produce my antennas. I build them "off the cuff" so to speak. It's not necessarily because I know what I'm doing so much as how I'm doing it.

 

[Boat Anchor 63]

HomerBB,
I'm looking for skywave propagation conditions only so the inverted v should be what's needed.
I have a 11m extended double zepp wire antenna that I can put between 45'-50' that should be able to give me a directional signal with it pointed east/west. What do you think?

 

[HomerBB]

HomerBB,
I'm looking for skywave propagation conditions only so the inverted v should be what's needed.
I have a 11m extended double zepp wire antenna that I can put between 45'-50' that should be able to give me a directional signal with it pointed east/west. What do you think?

It may work, but requires trying it to see. You can't do any better than that. That is what I do. Build them and try them.

 

[WA2SI]

Oh boy, a 'G5RV' for 11 meters!
Is it really? No, but it has about the same appeal probably. Now all you have to do is figure a way of turning it in the right direction.

If you like playing with antennas then have at it. It will certainly work. But there's no big advantage to using one. It also has disadvantages, such as making that ladder line matching section and tuning the thing to work in your mounting situation.
- 'Doc

I've used my 30m doublet on 11m as its dimensions are slightly longer than an 11m EDZ. I ran the open-wire feeder all the way to a 1:1 current balun mounted by the window and let the tuner handle the rest. Worked like gangbusters! Have fun with it.

Bert

 

[Boat Anchor 63]

Not a bisquare, an omni diamond, designed it myself, best antenna I have used so far. Have tested them down to 40 cm width, have great swr, with 4:1 balun, I have built 3 of these hung them in many locations even low to the ground, they have worked better than anything so far, I have built or bought 5/8 , 1/4 wave, 1.2 wave, moxon, jpole, inverted v, quads, delta loops, dipoles, l dipoles. Currently running one diamond horizontal, and one diamond vertical and one is for portable and testing. View attachment 36736 View attachment 36737

Happy New Year 2021.
I decided to build you're omnidirectional loop antenna. I have only one question. Does it work locally and how far have you talked. Enclosed are 2 angle of radiation pattern's.
1. You're fullwave diamond omnidirectional antenna.
2. 5/8 wave omnidirectional antenna.
Is yours still better? Any help would be greatly appreciated.