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307 Amps 2X6 Base Amp Issue

AK #5

Well-Known Member
Oct 31, 2014
228
162
53
Murray KY.
I just got a new 2X6 and when running it, my audio sounds fuzzy and crunchy on SSB and AM. Sounds worse on SSB.

Any idea what could be causing it? It's a brand new amp. Pretty frustrated over it.
 
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used it on SSB and it sounded great. The amp is unbiased.
Hmmm. Contradictory statement. Can't be both.

Best way to tell if this is the problem will require a second radio to use as a monitor. You won't need headphones to prevent feedback, because the first step is to turn down the radio's mike gain just above the wattage needed to key the relay. Should be under 3 to 4 Watts peak. Lower is better. If it has a "rough" sound that mostly goes away when the mike gain is turned back up, the amplifier transistors either have too little bias or none at all.

A sideband linear needs to amplify the lower-level parts of the voice waveform the same as the full-bore peaks. This is what the bias current on the RF transistors does. No need for this feature in AM mode. The AM carrier does this job with no need for a circuit to switch bias current on only when the relay is keyed. You don't want that bias current running on the receive side.

The other possibility is that the radio is overdriving the amplifier. The radio's internal sideband modulation limiter or "ALC" serves to hold the drive level to the radio's finals below their max peak limit. They really do sound better that way. But if the amplifier is pushed to the "flattopping" point where modulation peaks get sliced off you'll get distortion with the mike gain turned up, but clean audio with it turned down.

More than one way for an amplifier to sound bad on sideband, but those are the two most-popular methods.

73
 
Hmmm. Contradictory statement. Can't be both.

Best way to tell if this is the problem will require a second radio to use as a monitor. You won't need headphones to prevent feedback, because the first step is to turn down the radio's mike gain just above the wattage needed to key the relay. Should be under 3 to 4 Watts peak. Lower is better. If it has a "rough" sound that mostly goes away when the mike gain is turned back up, the amplifier transistors either have too little bias or none at all.

A sideband linear needs to amplify the lower-level parts of the voice waveform the same as the full-bore peaks. This is what the bias current on the RF transistors does. No need for this feature in AM mode. The AM carrier does this job with no need for a circuit to switch bias current on only when the relay is keyed. You don't want that bias current running on the receive side.

The other possibility is that the radio is overdriving the amplifier. The radio's internal sideband modulation limiter or "ALC" serves to hold the drive level to the radio's finals below their max peak limit. They really do sound better that way. But if the amplifier is pushed to the "flattopping" point where modulation peaks get sliced off you'll get distortion with the mike gain turned up, but clean audio with it turned down.

More than one way for an amplifier to sound bad on sideband, but those are the two most-popular methods.

73
I'm using a Radioddity QT 60 to drive the amplifier. 35-40W PEP , no more than 40-45W PEP.. It was tested after it was built using 50W drive, so I know it's not being overdriven. I just tested it using my Galaxy as a monitor, but haven't tried low mic gain as you suggest. I Will do that today and post the numbers. But the radio sounds awful on SSB without the amplifier... the amp just exacerbates the problem. But I did try it with a Cobra 148 GTL and still sounded awful, so I'm beginning to think I'm going to send this back to Jim @ 307 Amps and have a bias circuit put in it.
 
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I'm no guru, but 30-40W average is probably more than you should be hitting that amp with, especially on sideband. Amps with built in drivers really don't need much drive, that's what the driver section is for. What sounds okay on AM sounds like crap on SSB. What are you seeing for PEP from the amplifier? If you're seeing over 600-700W, you're way overdriving that thing.
 
I'm no guru, but 30-40W average is probably more than you should be hitting that amp with, especially on sideband. Amps with built in drivers really don't need much drive, that's what the driver section is for. What sounds okay on AM sounds like crap on SSB. What are you seeing for PEP from the amplifier? If you're seeing over 600-700W, you're way overdriving that thing.
To be clear, I'm putting 5W dead key 35-40W PEP into the amp, which gives me about 120 average dead key, swinging 1400 PEP. I can drive it harder, but I want it to last.
 
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Is it's HG's? Is the six 2879C? The C's can take more drive and voltage. I asked Carlbuilt about the voltage, and he said 15 volts would work just fine on the C's.

Anyway, just trying to clear up exactly what you have in the box.
 
Mine has 2 2290s driving 6 2879s. Not sure who makes them. I'm pretty sure that they are 2879Cs but I have to look.
 
After talking extensively with Jim over at 307 Amos, he's going to install a bias circuit and SSB delay for me. I just want to thank you guys for your input, it's greatly appreciated!!! I can't complain though, a good friend won another amp, and gifted this to me, so I can't complain at all. The amplifier is only 2 months old so it will be worth it to put a little money into it.
 
If it’s a class C amp with no SSB delay switch it would unusable on SSB right now. You will need class B or class AB for ssb use. With no delay switch on ssb the amp will click and chatter the whole time. Also at 40-45 watts peak input your over driving the piss out of it. The 2290’s are your drivers, let them do all the work. The radio should peak at say 10-18 watts. Hope this guy gets it’s right for you.
 
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If it’s a class C amp with no SSB delay switch it would unusable on SSB right now. You will need class B or class AB for ssb use. With no delay switch on ssb the amp will click and chatter the whole time. Also at 40-45 watts peak input your over driving the piss out of it. The 2290’s are your drivers, let them do all the work. The radio should peak at say 10-18 watts. Hope this guy gets it’s right for you.
With the switch in the up position, the relays chatter. In the down position, it does not. All I know, is it's going back to the builder so it can be done right. Not sure why the builder would test it @ 50W PEP if that's the case. I cannot get a straight answer out of anyone regarding these amplifiers.
 
you said the amp was new, but mentioned the previous owner.
did you mean that it was new to you?

also, a 5 watt deadkey is too much for the two pill section of that amp.
try it with a 2 watt deadkey and see if that improves anything.
LC
 
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