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Cobra 29LTD Classic - Delay from key up to audio

Ok, here's another from my archives...

1708171789860.png

Here are some more thoughts.

Ok, Pin 3 of the MIC jack, grounds a portion of the Mic amp itself - that R65, this Line routes to an area the has the toggle part for the TX switch.

So if something is amiss, this line needs to be investigated to make sure that other voltages are not getting sent into and are not present in TX affecting the Mic amp - or mods done to get more out of the Mic amp itself - check and replace values as needed to bring this back to stock
 
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There is more to this...

Then you think back to the first part of this thread, the OP didn't have issues with PA, but only TX delay.

You have RF, yes, but any simple RF power meter and a dummy load would show that.

So when you know what seems to work (Audio) because PA does work, the delay must be from other sources - so the radio has a receive and that seems to work.

Ok, the TX "seems" to work but has an audible delay in working.

One suggestion here is to see if that RF delay is from a "shift" in the TX frequency that occurs - because of it's design. The radio uses a shifted frequency of 455kHz from RX receiver IF frequency and changes to TX frequency by that 455kHz.

You'd hear this as an artifact from the "Monitor" radio tuned to listen in and is just one off in channel to the radio you're testing. (Test on 19, but listen on 20) This artifact would only occur as the radio first keys up - and would not continue to happen in later keyups - only after some delay, this might show up again.

So look thru the sections - to me I would start another re-tune process starting back at the Radios own Local Oscillator - on the 29 that's by the PLL. L22 - use R85 to view this waveform on a scope or for a simpler test, tune the radio to channel 40 - key up - with the monitor radio on 39, see if the artifact (a keyup noise even a whoosh or chirp may be heard) does appear with this method on a higher frequency channel - then repeat this process on the lowest frequency channel - Channel 1 with the Monitor listening in on Channel 2.

Other things to notice are the delay if it's shorter or non-existent - even after multiple attempts and restarts - can you recreate the condition on any extreme channel of the band - or does this effect you're having only happen on one side of channels - not other side - upper channels towards 40 or lower channel towards 1?

IF this occurs seemingly on all channels and only on the first keyups, the problem seems to be focused on TX switch and possible Mixer IC IC3. These two areas are part of the TX RF that happens when you switch the radio from RX to TX and the PLL must also shift the VCO by 455kHz to meet the 10.240 to the now ~16.xxx MHz + 455kHz signal the other half of the IF (the PLL VCO) is now showing up as output on IC3 - the TX MIXER IC as also is TOGGLED by the TX switch - it gets it's power from it to turn on.

1708218970630.png

Ok, why all the talk when you seem to have RF present - you just can't get audio at the same time? Review the 29 schematic - you have to realize other connections made to MIC jack pin 3 offer clues as to this delay.

One of them is quite direct, it's D20 part of where the RX to TX light changes - so this bi-color LED lamp shows Green, and will show RED even when TX voltage is not quite 100% where it should be.

Another area to look at and observe is D17 (RX) and D8 (TX) diodes D17 steers regulated adjustable power to the 10.240 Xtal using "Delta tune" control - but is shut off and the TX preset power is sent to the 10.240MHz Varactor diode instead, thru a preset and predetermined dropping resistor (R99 4.7K). That is if and when the TX power is "there" and RX power is shut off using Pin 3 and steering diodes (D17), the Mic Bias resistor R65 and R101 to drop RX voltage to ground and tell TR21 to turn on. The 10.240 Xtal Varactor can see a wobble in this switchover - as well as the Mic Bias quench line (a bias voltage used to put the Mic amp transistor TR17 into cut-off using R65) is also tied to D20, D15 (PLL TX 455kHz switch) and R101 and thus goes to Pin 3 TX switch ground when the Mic is keyed.

So this is not done, the delay can be for many reasons and to help isoalte it, you need to closely monitor how the RF wave is produced, for if the RX to TX switchover and 455kHz shift is taking a lot of time, some of these audio conditions you're hearing are from this contention.

It could be as simple as retweaking the L21 and L20 coils once L22 and L23 are "set" and if you can, verify that Delta Tune DOES NOT change the TX votlage - for if it does change the transmit frequecy too, this may be part of the problem
 
There is more to this...

Then you think back to the first part of this thread, the OP didn't have issues with PA, but only TX delay.

You have RF, yes, but any simple RF power meter and a dummy load would show that.

So when you know what seems to work (Audio) because PA does work, the delay must be from other sources - so the radio has a receive and that seems to work.

.....
In post 20, when I specifically asked this, the OP states that the delay also exists in PA.
 
In post 20, when I specifically asked this, the OP states that the delay also exists in PA.
Then suprised why they have not checked Pin 3 - and the switch circuit - TR21 is toggled off and when in PA mode - bypassed.

You still have 8V (TR23 Regulation) but everything else would be shut down - I'm looking at a 29LTD - now other Cobras keep the RX working while in PA, but in the PA function - it will turn off the TX - and then you need to check D21 - this is a "steering diode" for the TX function to get "starved off" when the PA function is on.

Now to me if the Diode is shorted, the TX function will attempt to Key up and may even show RF, but the line to the TX switch that supplied the power to the P of the PNP (Emitter) should be off - but another effect is that TR21 (and other sources up to and including the Delta Tune) - can "leak" power which would then change the power Flow across R101 and Pin 3.

Some mods will change the TX frequency to a point where it seems you're retuning a coil just to align the TX frequency back to being on the "nickles" versus the "dimes". Again a history repair - not sure...

However, the "Mod monster" can appear - this can also mean that part of the PA circuit wiring might be soldered to the wrong holes on the board. Not sure of the history of the patient but if works been done - and then find it didn't work, and then reversed out and handed back - *SIGH* - seen that too...

I've seen this happen when radios arrive they don't work and someone tried to make the "Talkback" work thru the PA switch, just have to locate and solder the wires from the PA switch back to where they belong - if not done, can do quirky things to mic audio in the process - wonder if this (radio) is one of them.

Ok, this can get into a convoluted mess. I'll step back and let you continue - you've been a great asset to this community and I don't want to add more to the porridge of ideas and solutions - except to tell you you're doing a great job and please continue.
 

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