CONCIDERING HF TRANSCEIVER(11 METER MOD)

[wavrider]

I'll just post this. I guess I don't have a clue:

I also have six first in England for the CQ-WW, CQ-WPX, IARU World HF Championship and ARRL International DX contests. My scores are in the top 20% of all entries for all classes worldwide including those running 1.5kW into multi-stacked yagis on massive towers.

What the whiners on that site can't accept is someone who has been licensed only a few years and not being a brass key pounder holding what is considered a cornflake packet license doing that well.

I'm on this board because to be honest, amateur radio is seemingly full of people just waiting for god and CBers seem to have a lot more fun with radio.

Well said, and yes CB'ers do have fun with their hobby, but also new license holders do to.

Last night on the 10 meter WDX contest I heard a 7 station on 28.300 calling CQ, I listened to him for a few minutes and he was persistent, then finally he just transmitted " can anyone hear this dog"

I had to laugh and then answer the call, new tech, had a 1/2 wl dipole made out of speaker wire taped to the antenna of his car, he was out in the desert in arizona camping.

He was having fun and someone did INDEED hear that dog.

It is a hobby, if you can not have fun with it then why bother?

 

[fourstringburn]

It isn't the hard way, its the proper way.

By using the front mic socket, as the video states, you use the mic-preamp of the radio and all the distortion it has and any equalisation it applies to the input thus in most cases undoing what you're trying to achieve to some extent. Using the ACC socket on the back bypasses the mic pre-amp and this also means you bypass the distortion and any equalisation of the radio. You therefore get transmitted audio which is far far nearer what the mixer is outputting than by using the mike socket. Your TS590 being used the way you are is applying equalisation to the equalised signal you're putting into it.

That can be true, but that can be controlled by the output signal of the mixer. I will agree It would be better to go direct into the ACC connector so there isn't double pre-amping.

I don't want to use this forum to ask questions on hooking this up in this fashion since we both have the same HF radio.

Can I email you from your address posted on QRZ?

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

Not using the mic input also will increase the signal to noise ratio of your audio. Most line level amps have a considerably high noise floor compared to a mic amp even when padded down. Connee is correct about using the acc input to feed audio into an HF rig even if it is mic audio. Just use a GOOD preamp.

 

[fourstringburn]

It isn't the hard way, its the proper way.

By using the front mic socket, as the video states, you use the mic-preamp of the radio and all the distortion it has and any equalisation it applies to the input thus in most cases undoing what you're trying to achieve to some extent. Using the ACC socket on the back bypasses the mic pre-amp and this also means you bypass the distortion and any equalisation of the radio. You therefore get transmitted audio which is far far nearer what the mixer is outputting than by using the mike socket. Your TS590 being used the way you are is applying equalisation to the equalised signal you're putting into it.

I just came up with an easier solution. I bypassed my mixer altogether. I only used a small mixer because I needed Phantom power for a Ribbon mic activator box which allows for variable input higher impedance loading which makes Ribbon mic's shine while still keeping the output impedance around 300 ohms which is just fine for the radio's mic input. This is not a preamp though. I never needed the mixer EQ because I prefer the EQ settings offered in my radio's rig control software program and I believe I would lose this capability using the ACC input.

I realized I had an old Phantom power supply box stashed away so now I can and prefer to use the radios mic input.

Thanks for the information making me realize this.

 

[M0GVZ]

That can be true, but that can be controlled by the output signal of the mixer. I will agree It would be better to go direct into the ACC connector so there isn't double pre-amping.

I don't want to use this forum to ask questions on hooking this up in this fashion since we both have the same HF radio.

Can I email you from your address posted on QRZ?

Yeah no problem. I've had the TS590 since they were launched.

 

[Stellasstillarat]

Thanks Brett. great information. I don't know if it's common to purchase a ham transceiver before even considering getting a ticket but in my case it may be the step that leeds me in that direction. I remember a friend many years ago who purchased a recivers before a transciver. Then purchesed his first transceiver after reciving his novice license.He knew early on he wanted to be a licensed operator. the fact that there are so many hf transceivers on 11 meters leeds me to think most operators purchase hf rigs to operate on 11 then slowly but surely work on getting a ticket. Many might just buy and use hf transceivers to use exclusivly on 11 and never get a ticket. I also assumed that when the skip dies on 11 It also dies on all bands. Im rarely on am and am spending 99% of my air time on ssb making skip contacts. The fact it's gonna stop maybe a great motivator towards getting a ticket now that I know the skip soothing can continue on ham radio band's. Thanks

So many ways you can go here it's not even funny. I was in a very similar situation as you several years back. I picked an Icom IC-718 mainly for cost. I too, wanted that smooth sound on SSB. Later added an Inrad narrow SSB filter, which made a huge difference in the receive. I still have this rig, and really enjoy it. There are many others out there in your price range.

I know hams are always pushing people to get their ticket... so here goes my push now that I am one. You mentioned the DX dying out due to the solar cycle. That's the main reason I got my ticket... DX is there on other bands when 11 meters is dead! I'd pick a rig that suits your needs and that you like to operate. Get your ticket! Triple conversion and quad conversion might turn out to be something you don't care about. My OLD TS-520 has one of the nicest sounding receivers I've ever listened to, and it is a just a dual conversion rig.

73,
Brett

So many ways you can go here it's not even funny. I was in a very similar situation as you several years back. I picked an Icom IC-718 mainly for cost. I too, wanted that smooth sound on SSB. Later added an Inrad narrow SSB filter, which made a huge difference in the receive. I still have this rig, and really enjoy it. There are many others out there in your price range.

I know hams are always pushing people to get their ticket... so here goes my push now that I am one. You mentioned the DX dying out due to the solar cycle. That's the main reason I got my ticket... DX is there on other bands when 11 meters is dead! I'd pick a rig that suits your needs and that you like to operate. Get your ticket! Triple conversion and quad conversion might turn out to be something you don't care about. My OLD TS-520 has one of the nicest sounding receivers I've ever listened to, and it is a just a dual conversion rig.

73,
Brett

 

[M0GVZ]

Thanks Brett. great information. I don't know if it's common to purchase a ham transceiver before even considering getting a ticket but in my case it may be the step that leeds me in that direction.

I also assumed that when the skip dies on 11 It also dies on all bands. Im rarely on am and am spending 99% of my air time on ssb making skip contacts. The fact it's gonna stop maybe a great motivator towards getting a ticket now that I know the skip soothing can continue on ham radio band's. Thanks

You'll have an easier time making the transition if you listen on the ham bands prior to going on them to get a feel of operating procedures, the do's and don'ts, how propogation works, which bands are day bands, which are night etc.

As you've indicated, one of the massive advantages of amateur radio is the sheer number and spread of the bands we have from ultra-low frequencies right through to microwave. We're therefore not limited by the time of day, what time of year it is or where we are in the solar cycle - we just adjust the bands we use accordingly.

 

[Stellasstillarat]

I know it may sound strange c omming from someone who operates way above the allocated 40 channels but I would never operate on amateur radio band's. Is this a contradiction? Absolutely but I respect bands that operaters had to put the time and study into in order to gain that right. I will and am actually looking forward to getting my first hf transceiver which will acutely be a reciver. Besides when im on the allocated 40 and well you know where else (555). It's really strange but I belive more than 50% of stations operating on the so called freebands are ticket holders. My Madison goes to 28.0805. Granted not far into 10 but have never nor will ever key my mic there. I appreciate your advice and all though I break/bend the rules I will never what I think is totally crossing the line. I hope to be making contacts on the bands alowed to be operated by a novice /tec sometime by summer.thanks.

You'll have an easier time making the transition if you listen on the ham bands prior to going on them to get a feel of operating procedures, the do's and don'ts, how propogation works, which bands are day bands, which are night etc.

As you've indicated, one of the massive advantages of amateur radio is the sheer number and spread of the bands we have from ultra-low frequencies right through to microwave. We're therefore not limited by the time of day, what time of year it is or where we are in the solar cycle - we just adjust the bands we use accordingly.

 

[Stellasstillarat]

That's definitely hilarious. In twenty years from now a large majority of anal ham operators will havr gone to the big station in the sky and I could definitely imagine hearing on amateur bands operaters, calling "cq cq it's 4:20 smokem if ya gotem". It's no longer a baby boomers planet. It belongs to the young.imagine how many grandfathers are gonna have sleaves and dropping holes in there earlobes? Think about.it. if the test to get a ticket has gone from knowing antenna theory values of resistors and code to what it is now.will it even exist in the future? It might consist of being able to count to ten and know your abc's.

Well said, and yes CB'ers do have fun with their hobby, but also new license holders do to.

Last night on the 10 meter WDX contest I heard a 7 station on 28.300 calling CQ, I listened to him for a few minutes and he was persistent, then finally he just transmitted " can anyone hear this dog"

I had to laugh and then answer the call, new tech, had a 1/2 wl dipole made out of speaker wire taped to the antenna of his car, he was out in the desert in arizona camping.

He was having fun and someone did INDEED hear that dog.

It is a hobby, if you can not have fun with it then why bother?

 

[BBB]

Warning. Text wall follows:

IMO, save up a few extra bucks and find a used Yaesu FT-1000MP HF Base rig for under a grand and you will have the some of best of both AM & SSB worlds. I've mentioned this before but have been so completely satisfied with the AM TX audio reports it is worth repeating. Of course the receiver section is top notch.

You get built in separate dual receivers that you can listen to two frequencies at the same time, built in power supply, built in antenna tuner and a (2) Toshiba 2sc2879 final amplifier section! There are many more positive features. Plug it into the 120 VAC wall outlet and your good to go.

SSB is good for 100+ watts. No problem getting 100% modulation here with a quality power desk mic. AM TX sounds great at 10 watt dead key and 40 watts peak (if you can live with that until you can get an external amp for bigger watts)

This rig, fed into a well constructed high drive (4) pill Toshiba 2sc2879 comp box on a 100 amp DC supply with a little reverb and audio compression, sounds awesome on AM. (there will be Class C non-believers) It has better audio than my Stryker 955 and that rig puts out on AM if you know what I'm talking about. The 1000MP even does ESSB and HiFi AM when the DSP is enabled if you want. Just sayin'...

General coverage is obtained with push buttons on the front. No need to open it up or send it out. I do not have experience with the FT-1000MP MkV or the FT-1000MP Field transceivers and can only vouch for the Yaesu FT-1000MP. There are substantial differences.

FYI most solid state HF shack-in-a-box rigs do not sound good on AM transmit. I admit that I have other HF rigs that do not sound that good on AM transmit like the Yaesu 857/897D. My Kenwood 430s has decent AM audio out but the AM receive isn't so great. The Tempo/ Uniden 2020 and FT-101EE have decent AM audio out, but again need some modification/ filters added to get the AM receive audio to sound right.

Your interest in the hobby can grow with a big rig like the Yaesu FT-1000MP base station. If I saw another one for under a $K and had the cash in my pocket I'd get a second one just for a back up

 

[Stellasstillarat]

excellent information. Thanks. I've been looking at and researching the ft 990. I'm in no rush to make a purchase as I don't want to spend $1000 plus on any hf only to find out I've purchased a transceiver thats not capable of performing the way I need and would like it too.. I actually have Been looking at the ft 1000 models. I've also heard a few of them on 27 megahertz and I've been very impressed with the single side audio.I haven't heard one on am but from the research Im not e xspecting too much on audio performance from any hf transceiver on sm and will be pleasantly surprised to get decent quality am audio out of my hf purchese. there's one thing in your post that I am confused about. I hope that you can set me straight on it. Are you saying that to operate the radio in general coverage (11meters) transmit and receive doesn't require opening the radio and snipping removing replacing and or soldering in order to transmit and receive on 27? that would be a great plus but I'm not that concerned about it as I do deal with an excellent tech who has repaired and refurbished many of my old prized radios. he doesn't specialize in one particular type of radio but all types. as I said it would be great not to have to ship it out for the general coverage tx/rx mod..Thanks again.

Warning. Text wall follows:

IMO, save up a few extra bucks and find a used Yaesu FT-1000MP HF Base rig for under a grand and you will have the some of best of both AM & SSB worlds. I've mentioned this before but have been so completely satisfied with the AM TX audio reports it is worth repeating. Of course the receiver section is top notch.

You get built in separate dual receivers that you can listen to two frequencies at the same time, built in power supply, built in antenna tuner and a (2) Toshiba 2sc2879 final amplifier section! There are many more positive features. Plug it into the 120 VAC wall outlet and your good to go.

SSB is good for 100+ watts. No problem getting 100% modulation here with a quality power desk mic. AM TX sounds great at 10 watt dead key and 40 watts peak (if you can live with that until you can get an external amp for bigger watts)

This rig, fed into a well constructed high drive (4) pill Toshiba 2sc2879 comp box on a 100 amp DC supply with a little reverb and audio compression, sounds awesome on AM. (there will be Class C non-believers) It has better audio than my Stryker 955 and that rig puts out on AM if you know what I'm talking about. The 1000MP even does ESSB and HiFi AM when the DSP is enabled if you want. Just sayin'...

General coverage is obtained with push buttons on the front. No need to open it up or send it out. I do not have experience with the FT-1000MP MkV or the FT-1000MP Field transceivers and can only vouch for the Yaesu FT-1000MP. There are substantial differences.

FYI most solid state HF shack-in-a-box rigs do not sound good on AM transmit. I admit that I have other HF rigs that do not sound that good on AM transmit like the Yaesu 857/897D. My Kenwood 430s has decent AM audio out but the AM receive isn't so great. The Tempo/ Uniden 2020 and FT-101EE have decent AM audio out, but again need some modification/ filters added to get the AM receive audio to sound right.

Your interest in the hobby can grow with a big rig like the Yaesu FT-1000MP base station. If I saw another one for under a $K and had the cash in my pocket I'd get a second one just for a back up

 

[BBB]

That is correct, you do not have to open the radio to enable general coverage including 11 meters BUT please be aware that once the radio is converted you will have the ability to transmit "out of band" which could lead to trouble if done on Emergency/ Safety Frequencies, so get yourself an amateur radio frequency sheet off the net to refer to when/ if you get your ham ticket like this one here... You'll need to know these band plans to pass the exams anyway:

http://www.arrl.org/files/file/Regulatory/Band Chart/Hambands_color.pdf

Here's the link for the FT-1000MP conversion:

http://foxtango.org/RIGMODS/FT-1000MP.htm

Do not confuse the Yaesu FT-1000MP with the" FT-1000", "FT-1000MP Mark V" or the "FT-1000MP Field" as again I cannot speak for there ability to produce good transmit results on AM even though they may look very much the same. Also, try not to be overwhelmed by all the buttons and knobs on the FT-1000MP as that just means you don't have to dip into menus to adjust the RF power, DSP settings, ect.

Did I mention that it has adjustable RF power right on the front and direct frequency entry via the keypad oh yeah and a little more on the dual tuners: " the Dual Receive feature of the FT 1000MP allows the operator to watch both sides of a pile up, or monitor QSOs on two different frequencies and modes within the same band."(Actually you can slip a band or two and it still works fine) "The Main and Sub VFOs can be placed in the "tracking" mode, allowing efficient diversity operation with a touch of a button. The sub-receiver has its own S meter, too." The rig also sports "AM Synchronous Tuning Ideal for shortwave listening, the synchronous detection system of the FT-1000MP provides less fading and improved signal fidelity, compared to previous AM detectors." The rig also has a true separate monitoring feature so you can hear exactly how you sound going out the pipe.

Listening with the "diversity tuning" thru a good pair of studio headphones is a mind-blowing-life-like-stereo effect like you've never heard on a HF rig. Sure a lot of other rigs have similar features... but for for way more $$$$.$$

Oh, I almost forgot the FT-1000MP radio is big and heavy so it takes up some real estate in the shack. Sorry for the long post. I just wanted to spike your interest. Good luck with your search for a radio that works for you.

 

[M0GVZ]

BBB why are you using a power mike on a FT1000? It has adjustable mic gain and compression.

A power mic on a ham HF set will just overdrive the mic preamp in the radio.

 

[w9cll]

A power mic on a ham HF set will just overdrive the mic preamp in the radio.

I disagree, I power mic is an option on an HF rig if adjusted properly. I run an Astatic 1104c on my 101zd and have had nothing but compliments on the audio quality. The secret is to adjust it correctly and watch the ALC meter.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

The only way I would run an amplified mic on sn HF rig is if it was turned down pretty much all the eay and if the mic sounded really good woth the racio. An HF rig has much more audio gain than you would ever need by itself.