ESSB

[bushwacker]

I know there are quite a few hams on this site and alot of guys into sideband as well-- I was wondering if there was anyone out there thats been playing around with ESSB--enhanced single sideband-- or anyone that is using a higher bandwidth on ssb
I got to hear what it sounds like a few months ago-- a fellow Canadian in Vancover came booming in on lower 38-- His audio was incredable, even when I adjusted my clarifier either way quite a bit he still sounded really good-- I never did ask him if how much bandwidth he was using but it had to have been at least 6khz (maxiumun allowed in Canada is 6kc on ssb), but I would'nt doubt he was using 10kc-- there is another local up here thats been seriously looking into it alot.

I realise that sometimes a narrower bandwidth is better-- but the audio at wider bandwidth is a huge improvement-- Its certainly not a new idea anyways
Without starting a heated debate-- I was just curious if there is anyone out there using more bandwidth on ssb?

 

[bushwacker]

Yea-- well thats the thing-- it sure does sound good, but a narrower bandwidth is better for dx-- like on alot of hams use a really narrow bandwidth-- but you know all this already
Theres a local in my area thats really interested in it-- not the best for dx at low power-- but for local or if you have some extra push it sure sounds good
I was just curious if anyone else out there was using it or playing around with it
Certainly not anything new-- just wider bandwidth--- but this local in town is getting into it
I don't have a radio with adjustable bandwidth yet so figured I'd ask around to see if anyone else uses 6khz or wider bandwidth for ssb local or whatever

Thanks for the reply Justin

 

[bcrewcaptain]

and the next question, if you open it up on your radio, how does that effect talking to a reg ssb rig? are you missing anything on rx or tx at that point?seems like you'd be defeating purpose unless others were set up the same

 

[NorthStar]

Freecell has a mod he does to Cobra 148GTL's for the ESSB. Maybe he can chime in here.

 

[Fdtrucker]

Heres a good page with info on what ESSB is and even has a section on his page for mods that can be done. Nothing in there on cb's though.
nu9n.com/essb.html

 

[bushwacker]

and the next question, if you open it up on your radio, how does that effect talking to a reg ssb rig? are you missing anything on rx or tx at that point?seems like you'd be defeating purpose unless others were set up the same

No you can rx and tx the same with any radio-- its just how much bandwidth your using-- you more than likly have already heard someone using wider bandwidth already-- you can really notice someone using a real wide bandwidth if you touch your clarifier while he;s transmitting
If you have ever talked to someone on a Yasue ft840 (unmodded) on AM , then you have talked with someone using a different bandwidth-- usually stock those radios (and alot like them) only have 6 khz of bandwidth on AM
It just comes down to bandwidth-- as long as your on the same freq as the station txing and using the same mode, there is no problem
You can definatly hear the difference a wider bandwidth makes on ssb

 

[paws264]

www.w8ji.com/transmitter_splatter.htm

Technical Comments about Transmitter Intermodulation, Distortion, and ESSB (or Hi Fi Wide Fi SSB) audio or over equalization.

WideFi or Enhanced Audio

Enhanced SSB audio is a generally bad idea, since it adds and boosts unnecessary lows and highs. Audio response flattening brings levels of unnecessary low and high frequencies up, and this rapidly increases power level in unwanted off-frequency products compared to normal communications audio.

The frequency difference between lows and highs is wider, so the "junk" extends further than normal. The level of lows and highs are significantly stronger than levels in normal communications audio, and this makes IM products much stronger. As a matter of fact, energy in IM products does not follow a linear increase as base and treble are increased! Unwanted power on adjacent channels increases at several times the rate of the power increase in base and treble!

Make no mistake about it, enhanced SSB or Hi-fi SSB audio, even with perfect "brick wall" filtering, is always going to have significantly more unwanted energy on adjacent channels when compared to regular communications audio through the same system.

Three Greatest Sins
The three greatest sins creating unnecessary bandwidth are:
1. Turning up a radio's internal power or "drive limit" pot.
2. Enhancing Bass and Treble (Echo-Power Mic?)
3. Under-loading an amplifier

Summary

A normal two-tone test is not really very effective in measuring a SSB signal, because there is no slow dynamic change typical of a voice. Voltage regulation problems are masked and do not show up when a two-tone test is used, because load currents all average the same amount. Filter capacitors and other energy storage components mask any voltage regulation problems. We can, as a general rule, be confident the actual SSB voice performance is LESS than a two-tone test indicates.

A large improvement occurs with a three-tone test, when levels are varied at syllabic rates as well as higher frequencies in the voice range. This tests voltage regulation problems otherwise hid in a two-tone test, because all speech frequencies ranges are included. The most accurate test, of course, is with actual speech. The FCC now requires some commercial radios used on congested bands to be tested with actual speech.

We can help ease spectrum pollution by:

Strongly discouraging use of enhanced bass and treble on crowded bands. It has no place on crowded band or near weak signals. Wide-Fi is selfish and inconsiderate even when it uses a 3kHz filter because of the increase in level and frequency spread of IM products.


Discouraging and chastising people would turn the power limit or drive limit control inside radios up. This is CB behavior! There isn't a radio made that will tolerate a user-increase in power limit without a serious degradation in IM performance. If you have a friend who peaks up the power control inside a radio, tell him why it is bad. Radios are bad enough without removing even more headroom. Even the best transistors cannot be driven more than about half of saturated power before IM becomes unacceptable.


Making sure we use processing and ALC, but only at modest levels. We should just see the needles start to show compression.

Making sure we tune amplifiers correctly, and avoiding 12 volt transistor amplifiers or grid-driven tetrode amplifiers whenever possible.

www.w8ji.com/transmitter_splatter.htm

 

[freecell]

http://www.icycolors.com/nu9n/apologetics_2.html

 

[Fdtrucker]

Here's a list off the NU9N website. I like number "8". I think some people don't like essb. :shock:

COMMON MISCONCEPTIONS AND OBJECTIONS FOR EXTENDED SSB AUDIO
1 "Hi-fi SSB occupies excessive bandwidth."
2 "Hi-fi SSB is not an accepted 'J3E' mode. - 'J3E' means 3kHz"
3 "Hi-fi SSB is not consistent with FCC defined 'Good Amateur Practice' mandates."
4 "Hi-fi SSB is illegal as defined by the FCC 'Minimum Necessary Bandwidth' rule."
5 "Hi-fi SSB creates excessive IMD products and splatter."
6 "Hi-fi SSB produces an unwanted carrier and/or poor opposite sideband suppression."
7 "Hi-fi SSB is 10kHz or more wide."
8 "Hi-fi SSB is a self-centered, arrogant and selfish way to operate."
9 "Hi-fi SSB is not necessary to effectively communicate or necessary at all."
10 "Hi-fi SSB is destroying our hobby."
11 "Hi-fi SSB audio is too bassy or doesn't sound right."
12 "Hi-fi SSB does not belong in the Amateur Radio service."
13 "Human speech does not contain any useful frequencies above 3kHz."
14 "The traditional methods of processing SSB has been good enough so why change?"
15 "Hi-fi SSB operators intentionally interfere with QSO's that are close."
16 "Hi-fi SSB operators have 'ripped out' filters in their transmitters causing interference."
17 "The Amateur Radio Service is for communications audio - Not broadcat audio

 

[bushwacker]

Yea-- there are alot of people right against it-- they say its 10khz or more-- but even going up to 6khz is an improvement--
I don't see anything wrong with it,--its just a tradeoff-- better audio for less efficency

 

[paws264]

Freecell has a mod he does to Cobra 148GTL's for the ESSB. Maybe he can chime in here.

Where is it at?

.

 

[2M Guy]

Lots of complaints.

 

[Triple J]

I've been using ESSB for about 2 1/2 to 3 years now, even during the CDX contests. I run a Kenwood TS850 w/DSP 100 and W2IHY 8band eq. I didn't open the equipment up and make the mods that KA0KA made, but I do have my unit setup to transmit using 2.4khz, 4.5khz or 6.0khz of bandwith. I believe normal xmit bandwith for this radio is 2.7khz wide. 90% of the time that you hear me during the contests I am transmitting at 4.5khz of bandwith. I have found that seems to be the sweet spot for my radio, I get more unsolicited complements about my audio using that than any other bandwith. To get the most benefit of ESSB, I would think that both send and receive stations would have to be set up wide. Most of the time I am listening on 2.7khz wide to pull stations out of the noise better. If anyone is interested we could do some tests sometime on the air so you can see the different results of me changing my xmit bandwith. I just purchased another Kenwood TS850 due to the display on my old one just gave up on me. I hope this one works as good and lasts as long.
73's
CDX-311