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Running Texas Star 350HDV, Any "Good" Reason To Upgrade to 500V or 667V?

S

skiman1

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Aug 28, 2014
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Kind of a newbie question, new to the whole amp thing, and I'm running a Texas Star 350HDV with Toshiba's for AM & SSB, works great on both, I don't over power it, old school Cobra 148 deadkey at 2w's, swing to 15, SSB peak about 20, works great running with my Astron 50amp, MFJ-948 300w tuner, DX Engineering 400 type Coax into a Sirio Tornado 27, any reason to move up to a 500V or 667V?

I know there maybe a perceptible "db" difference, but not real world S-Units, from all the math on watts and dB and S-unit increase, seems like to get just one S-Unit more it would take 1200w or so compared to the 350 I'm running now. That's just a ridiculous upgrade for 1 S Unit!

Going by the math,

- 1 S Unit = 6db

Translates to...

- 100 to 400 watts = 1 S Unit increase (6 db)
- 400 to 1600 watts = 1 S Unit increase (6 db)
- 1600 to 6400 watts = 1 S Unit increase (6 db) in signal

To me it seems the magic number is 300w before you have to buy more expensive high power tuners, spend big bucks on huge power supplies and a mandatory upgrade to 213-400 type coax's, etc...

Thoughts?
 
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Skiman1 you hit it on the nail head.

Antenna antenna antenna is the best improvement you can make.
If it is a mobile install the a lot of bonding and grounding to be considered.

Amplifier can only do so much the rest is in the antenna system
 
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ShadeTreeMechanic said:
Get your antenna as high as you can get it first.
Click to expand...


wavrider said:
Skiman1 you hit it on the nail head.

Antenna antenna antenna is the best improvement you can make.
If it is a mobile install the a lot of bonding and grounding to be considered.

Amplifier can only do so much the rest is in the antenna system
Click to expand...

Only so much I can do on the height front, in a community and have the antenna on about 15ft of mast on a rugged tripod, I do OK with that setup. Most of the people I talk to are locals within 5 miles, have no problem getting out about 25-30 and the rest is DX. Is what it is for now. Eventually we are moving and then I plan on getting that antenna up there.
 
Welcome to WWDX!
If you still want a bigger amp for dx after the antenna optimization, then get the biggest one you can afford. To me if you already have the 350 then a 500 is not a big enough jump. Get an amp bigger than what you need so you don't have to run it hard. It will sound good and last a long time.
 
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ShadeTreeMechanic said:
Welcome to WWDX!
If you still want a bigger amp for dx after the antenna optimization, then get the biggest one you can afford. To me if you already have the 350 then a 500 is not a big enough jump. Get an amp bigger than what you need so you don't have to run it hard. It will sound good and last a long time.
Click to expand...

Thanks man, I've gleaned a lot of great info sandbagging here over the years, its really a great forum, thank you for the welcome!

I hear ya on the bigger to run it lower argument, even running the 350 with the Dial-A-Watt button in it knock's the wattage in half from 100 down to 50 on deadkey, but still peaks about about 275 or so, and that perfect, that extra 50-75w I can drain from it will not make a dent or make the difference in being heard or not. I'm a musician and recording guy, so I like audio to sound GOOD!

I hate that scuzzy pinched up crap and I gotta say the 350 sound's dynamite on SSB. I use it with a Yaesu 991A putting out 20w with a D-104 with 10DA head and work's great. For AM its my Taiwan 148 that just has that "bodacious" sound, it has fidelity as well as being loud and clear. It's 2w's swinging 20 Peak drives that amp like my Les Paul drive's a Marshall Plexi Tube Amp, it just frigging sings.

I'm thinking that for that ONE S UNIT, that even the headache of new tuner, new supply and bigger amp is just not worth it, especially for 11 Meters, I don't care or have to compete with the other guys on AM around here, luckily my close locals are good guys and don't cause a lot of crap and don't run tons of juice. 99% of the time, I speak with any of my locals I usually use my 2w carrier to do it.

Now the group that's 20-30 miles away from me? That's the 800w to 2k club and all they do is argue and fight, I'm far enough away where it doesn't bother me, and close enough where I can grab a Coke and Popcorn and enjoy the show :D
 
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I agree with everything said so far. If you can find an older clean TS500 with Toshiba's it might be worth buying just to hang on to it. The 350 and 500 are darn good amplifiers.
 
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9C1Driver said:
I agree with everything said so far. If you can find an older clean TS500 with Toshiba's it might be worth buying just to hang on to it. The 350 and 500 are darn good amplifiers.
Click to expand...

I did just that, found an old White Line 500V with Toshiba's, selling the 350 at this point because all I have to do is run it at 1/2 power and delivers what the 350 did.
 
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I think you should rethink how you have your radio set up. 2w modulating to 15 is not the best way to setup that radio or drive your amp. I understand that with transistor modulation instead of transformer based modulation you are not stuck with 4:1 rule. That said the 4:1 rule and 98% modulation would be a better way to fo, especially when using an amp.

I understand that it is possible to do 10:1 and sometimes even 15:1 but why run the gear that hard when you do not need too. After all that is why you have an amp.

100w then 600watts and then 1500w are what I consider to be logical jumps worthwhile from an economic and functional real-world performance standpoint. Any jump in between those is a waste of money unless that is your first unit or you get a particularly fantastic deal.

All of that said if I want to run 100w continuously I will select an amp that can do double that and then run it easy so it lasts and functions well at all times. Just like you would not drive your car or truck redlining constantly you do not want to run electronics to their limit either. Ideally, you want to remain linear at all times and keep your gear cool!

While height it might antenna design elements matter as well. I think you do not need to get crazy with height either as I think a lot of research has proven that once you go past a certain point based on wavelength you start to get diminishing returns.


When it comes to upgrading you coax is fine most base antenna are fine. You do not need a tuner once you go past a certain power level. A tuner is there to allow you use one antenna for multiple bands that it might not resonate at without an insane mismatch that would cause SWR issues and common mode issues big time! THink of it like a band aid fix for using the wrong antenna for the job.

A 667 is just a low drive 500 with a driver ahead of the 500 part. So if you did not have enough power to drive 4 x 2SC2879's than you turn your carrier power and swing down and use a 667 which has a 2SC2290 built into it to allow you to use a low power radio to drive the same 4 x 2SC2879's that would find in a 500.

Do you need more power? On that same note if you have extra money you do not need to save now is a good time to upgrade. You can still find and buy units that have Toshiba's. Prices never go down on amp's they just seem to go up and up and up. So the sooner you get in the less you will spend. The value of the dollar is always dropping and parts prices keep going up. I do not know anyone that has their rate of pay keeping pace with the drop in the value of the dollar!
 
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Onelasttime said:
I think you should rethink how you have your radio set up. 2w modulating to 15 is not the best way to setup that radio or drive your amp. I understand that with transistor modulation instead of transformer based modulation you are not stuck with 4:1 rule. That said the 4:1 rule and 98% modulation would be a better way to fo, especially when using an amp.
Click to expand...

That is from the ultimate peak watts whistling into the mic etc, carrier is about 2 watts and realistic talking avg watts is about 6-8, so when I run this 500 on low, and keeping the modulation at right at 100%, carrier is about 50 and swings to 200.

Onelasttime said:
All of that said if I want to run 100w continuously I will select an amp that can do double that and then run it easy so it lasts and functions well at all times. Just like you would not drive your car or truck redlining constantly you do not want to run electronics to their limit either. Ideally, you want to remain linear at all times and keep your gear cool!
Click to expand...

Yep, yep! That is the consensus it seems, its why I picked up the DX500 and selling the DX350. For SSB I wanted about 350-400 watts and the 500 does it on the low power setting vs driving the 350 to the max.
 

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