Antenna Opinions Please

[cominatyalive]

Actually,

You do not use a balun on a groundplane. A balun is used for transforming BALanced line( twinlead) to UNbalanced line( coax). A choke might be useful if you have problems with transient currents, though. That should save you a few bucks towards the antenna.

Sorry, but I just had to add my two cents worth here and toss down my friendly rant before anyone goes any farther. A Balun can be used as an RF Air Choke Balun also. This is why I made mine. Especially if you are pushing some major wattage out of your shack. I have spent months reading all I could about RF Choke Baluns. Here is one of many authorities on RF Choke Baluns from DXzone.com. I also believe the HamUniverse.Com site also has some major info & pictures on the subject.

choke balun

WHAT IS A CHOKE BALUN?
My friend Jim Duffy once said "Whatever antenna you chose, if it is fed with coaxial cable you should use a choke balun. This will prevent the feed line from becoming part of the antenna which can cause all sorts of problems. There are many designs to choose from. My favorite is an air core balun wound from coax".

Essentially, a choke balun is designed to "divorce" your antenna from the feed line. If your feed line is coaxial cable then you don't want it to be part of your antenna. You want to be able to deliver all your power to the radiator itself, i.e. "the antenna". A choke balun does this admirably.


I have pushed 40 to 50 watts and not once has my Fat neighbor lady ever complained about stray RF from my system. Also, about the IMAX. Now before you guys start crawling all over me wanting to screw the pooch, let me tell ya, YES! the I-10K is a far superior antenna. At least we agree on one thing.

But since I am a lowly CB'r with a Lowly Imax 2000, let me also tell you that with a little time & patience and like Robb said, (with just a hundred smackers) you can have a nice setup with the Imax. I have mine at 60 ft and for the record, yes! some time it is staticky! YES! sometimes it picks up a lot of electrical noises, but that's not every single night.

Most every night, I am only getting 1.5 db's of ground floor noise and that's with my RF gain pegged full throttle. And BTW, I always run my rig with the RF gain pegged. Turn it down just a hair & the noise quickly goes away. But I don't have to. Hows that for an antenna with a reputation for picking up a Rat pissing ten miles away? Not bad for a mere buck of cash eh? On the feedline issue & correct me if I'm wrong, but I have also heard that if stray RF does come back down your feedline, it could also cause some major damage to your rig, especially if your running high power, kind of the same way if your SWR was way high. But I'll leave that to the experts.

Anyways, I don't mean to sound as a know it all, but when it comes to RF I do know a thing or two. It also kind of peaves me that there are a few who will still condemn the Imax to the day they die. What's up with that? lol, kind of funny if you ask me. Compared to the Maco 5/8th? well, to each his own. I believe the Maco is a strong antenna also. I almost bought one myself & I like them all the same. The Avanti Astroplane was a killer 1/4 wave antenna. I used to have the original back in 1976. Wished I still had it. Funny how they claim it's a 1/2 wave now. New one on me. I bought my Imax for a few reasons, Cost, 5/8th wave, and the gain. However; if I knew beforehand it was a super charged hearing aide, I might have made a different choice. But it's really not as bad if you take the time to set it up right. Yes, it was 1.4:1 out of the box, but with a little turning of the tuning ring, you can get it lower.

One more thing comes to mind before I call it quits. No offense here, but I for one being a Imax 2000 owner, wouldn't dream of condemning someone's rig or antenna. It just ain't right. H_ll, I've even thought of getting a starduster lately. Back in the day, they were hailed as crap. Now they claim better ears & good for ten meters. Mmmmm, a lowly starduster, IMAGINE THAT! LMAO!!!!!! Just joking guys, yes, I actually want one. At $48.00 ya just can't beat it. Seriously though, I've had my eye on a Maco Y-Quad. Very cool antenna. Low price around $170.00 and more gain for Dxing. Well, maybe next year.

Cia!

Also, check out 64APL's homemade Ugly RF Choke Balun on his groundplane.
here is the URL from HamUniverse.Com showing his setup. it's near the bottom of the page.

cia!

BUILD AN AIR WOUND 1:1 CHOKE BALUN FOR HF - THE UGLY BALUN!

 

[cominatyalive]

I could be wrong, but a 1:1 balun could easily be replaced for an open air choke on any antenna.

Your not wrong.

 

[wavrider]

Your not wrong.

I use a ugly choke or 1:1 current balun on every antenna in the farm except for gamma matched parasitic radiators.


Any antenna can and most likely will have improved performance if a current balun can be installed at the feed point forcing equal distribution of current on both parts of the antenna.

That is unless the antenna design is to use the shield of the coax as the other half of the antenna.

Enjoy your antenna setup, the solar cycle is starting to pick up and a lot of DX will be out there.

 

[Dipstick]

I would go with the maco 5/8 too it is a great antenna.

 

[jazzsinger]

Most every night, I am only getting 1.5 db's of ground floor noise and that's with my RF gain pegged full throttle. http://www.hamuniverse.com/balun.html

A minor technical point is S meters are calibrated in s units not db's,1.5 s units above the receivers minimum sensitivity threshold on properly calibrated s meter would equate to 9db above that threshold,not 1.5 db,although most s meter (nearly all in fact) fail to meet the standard of 6db per s unit,the only part of the scale that is calibrated in db's is the part above S9.ie,S9 +10db,S9+ 20db,S9 +30db and so on.

Many people get confused with db's and s units on a signal meter.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

A minor technical point is S meters are calibrated in s units not db's,1.5 s units above the receivers minimum sensitivity threshold on properly calibrated s meter would equate to 9db above that threshold,not 1.5 db,although most s meter (nearly all in fact) fail to meet the standard of 6db per s unit,the only part of the scale that is calibrated in db's is the part above S9.ie,S9 +10db,S9+ 20db,S9 +30db and so on.

Many people get confused with db's and s units on a signal meter.

At least it was better then him saying he had 1.5 pounds above the noisefloor. :headbang

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

if youre just on and near the 11 meter/CB band the choke at hamuniverse is not what you want to use . there is a optimal choke diameter and number of wraps depending on the band you want to use . cb/11 meters 5 wraps on a 4 1/4 inch diameter former is optimal for our beloved chicken band .

http://www.worldwidedx.com/cb-antennas/62990-coax-choke-info.html

 

[cominatyalive]

Thanks Jazzsinger, I stand corrected. And a very good point indeed.

Yes, my meter says S/RF on it, but the bottom scale on my Zachary says +30db at the end of it. So I automatically thought the bottom scale was all in db's.

I've been so wrapped up in other issues, I failed to learn how to read my meters corectly. But on my magnum, the readout is only in S-units and it's only a digital bar graph.

Thus proving again how little much I know, and just how much I still need to learn. That's what I love about this site. A great place to learn.

Makes me feel humble, since I'm obviously learning more than I can give actually. But I know that may change as time goes on.

Many kind thanks.

And HOLY CRAP! Booty, Many thanks for the link to your Coax thread! I'm eating it up.
A good 1.5 pounds of it as the captain stated. lol boy do I feel foolish now. but far more grateful for your information.

Shows how much I studied before throwing up that whale of a choke. I read all the info I could in the thread, and there's a whole other can of worms here.
Now looking at the graph, I had one question, is 1K (the gold bar) what one would go by? or would 8K (the green bar) be as high of impedance I could go without being too reactive? is that the impedance color code? Mmmmm, I better go back & study it more. No matter how you slice it though, yes, going by 27 MHz it looks like 5 wraps on a 4.25" diameter form. I think that size & wraps would also be good for 10 meters?

Or maybe I don't need a choke at all? Because of this, I didn't notice anything, but my performance is obviously suffering. Yes, I'm lost.

PS: say, I bet all of you were laughing your a_ses off when you saw my monster coil? and you betcha! yes, I spent some time on it, not to mention how hard it is to find a
8" pvc form. I even special ordered it for crying out loud! LMAO!!!!!!!!! I think it's time Robb demoted me back to a Junior Member. LMAO!!!!!! Time to toss everything out the window! LMAO!!!
Hey Booty, who's penis swinging now? Now I know how Tiger Woods Feels! Talk about Penis swinging. Now where's that Emoticon option when I need it???? I don't see it anywhere. The one where the bat is beating the donkey's ass? ;-)

PS: Thank God it's still summertime & not the dead of winter so I can still fix my mistakes.

http://www.worldwidedx.com/cb-antennas/62990-coax-choke-info.html


Quote:
At least it was better then him saying he had 1.5 pounds above the noisefloor.
__________________
Light travels faster than the speed of sound, this is why some people tend to appear bright, until they decide to speak.

Love you're signature quote Captain K. How true it is. But then again, those who don't speak at all, get nowhere at all






James.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

comin be sure to check out the thread linked to in post 3 . i forgot i had seen that graph befor abd i couldnt make heads or tails of it the first time and forgot about it . anyhow that thread has some very good info in it .

http://www.worldwidedx.com/cb-antennas/48415-ugly-balun.html

green is better for the air chokes in the graph .

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

Love you're signature quote Captain K. How true it is. But then again, those who don't speak at all, get nowhere at all

James.

True but then there are those that say nothing and sit back and learn by listening. My signature is aimed at all those who have others convinced they know everything while those of us that know better can pick them out as soon as the bullshit starts flying. IOW those that subscribe to the theory that if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit. :laugh:

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

wise man can learn more from fool than fool can learn from wise man .

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

"Makes me feel humble, since I'm obviously learning more than I can give actually. But I know that may change as time goes on."

the reason this is my favorite forum is because of the quality of information given by the folks here . many folks here have long careers in RF engineering and the broadcast industry . some are hams that have been in the hobby for decades . you dont find that level of knowledge on most cb forums . most of those forums are just full of folks patting each other on the back because of how far they can make a meter swing . questions are most welcome here and cb bullshit legends and lies and misconceptions are exposed quickly . sometimes the spreader of those gets a hurt butt (because the truth doesnt help their sales and might decrease the number of sheep that follow them) and dont come back ... like my good buddies banhammer , mr. coily and bozo to name a few

 

[1342]

ok lots of opinions out here so here goes!best for the buck generic maco 5/8 or workman 5/8 $63 bucks second would be clearly imax 2000.as far as best performance lw-150 and next vector 4000.i10k for that much money i would by a small beam.the wolf looks pretty good and i bet that and the imax would perform pretty close to that overpriced 20 lb i10k sinker.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

"i bet that and the imax would perform pretty close to that overpriced 20 lb i10k sinker."

 

[Robb]

The humble price of the IMAX (usually less than $100) and the performance I've seen from it is quite quite fair. I've talked to Sydney Australia on 10m with it. Will work 10, 11, AND 12m w/o a tuner. Talked to more than a few Hams that have and use them for those bands.

The Maco can do 11 and may need to be re-tuned for 10; but the IMAX will do all of those bands and never need to be adjusted. Sure, you can trim and re-tune it for better resonance on any of those bands. But right out of the box, assembles REAL fast (three sections screw together - factory SWR pre-set), and you are talking. Try doing that with the Maco V58 - NOT!
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