Modified Vector 4000

[Marconi]

It was more about the modeling of the cone etc. I use a vector that I have modified I have my Intervector 10K in the works.

Hey BM, you didn't get MrS's point, in his comprehensive post, that he was talking about modeling. What's wrong with you boy?

What'd you do to modify the vector MrS, turn your hose clamps around the other way? I don't believe it, but if you can post a picture or two of this whiz-bang modified vector, and while you're at it show us a picture of the Intervector 10K you keep talking about.

If you can't provide this simple proof about what you claim, then I might just think your imagination is all that you have working.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

well , he had offered his words of wisdom about a different matching system working with the vector style antennas , but no one else has had any success with that . that's why i was wondering if the scanned antenna was what that comment was based on , even though its a completely different style of antenna ......... not that i could afford to pay him for that top secret information :bdh:

and im pretty sure the invector 10k is just a joke on his part ....... it would be interesting to see if he tried to use the basket/cone in the scanned image on it though
but , he has had some quality knowledge to share , albeit with a healthy dose of chest beating on his part

 

[MrSuburban]

well , he had offered his words of wisdom about a different matching system working with the vector style antennas , but no one else has had any success with that . that's why i was wondering if the scanned antenna was what that comment was based on , even though its a completely different style of antenna ......... not that i could afford to pay him for that top secret information :bdh:

and im pretty sure the invector 10k is just a joke on his part ....... it would be interesting to see if he tried to use the basket/cone in the scanned image on it though
but , he has had some quality knowledge to share , albeit with a healthy dose of chest beating on his part

Booty no you probably couldnt afford as you couldnt even afford to pay for aluminum with a slit in it.

It isn't my fault you or the others can't get another type of matching network to work. You can prod and goad all you want I give out info when I want not when you want.

I will post this pic just to have you guys critique it and tell me what I am doing wrong.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

Booty no you probably couldnt afford as you couldnt even afford to pay for aluminum with a slit in it.

LOL , there's lots of things i can't afford .
why should i pay you for information others who are in the hobby for enjoyment are so willing to share ?
i hope you're not too disappointed that i don't let your comment on my lack of money cause me any shame

It isn't my fault you or the others can't get another type of matching network to work. You can prod and goad all you want I give out info when I want not when you want.

i would look forward you seeing your vector style antenna work with something other than a gamma match .
but i think its a bunch of hot air and that you will use a gamma match like everyone else .
feel free to prove me wrong though

I will post this pic just to have you guys critique it and tell me what I am doing wrong.

looks good so far .
but i only see 3 basket elements , both bob85 and shockwave saw better performance with a 4th basket element . i guess sirio did to since they also use 4 of them .
is one hidden behind the vertical ?
is the lil tripod the vertical is in gonna be your bottom bracket ?
i dont see anything wrong in the pic , looks like a nice xerox of the sigma 4 loop and element connections .
or is it just a pic of the sigma 4 basket ?

ATM the only possible problem i see is with you selling them since i think your people skills leave a bit to be desired .
but that's just my opinion and really doesn't mean crap .
the number of intervector 10k's you sell will tell how right or wrong i am about that .

 

[Shockwave]

I'll admit my curiosity is present concerning alternate matching methods on this antenna. When you consider all of the various way to match antennas, it's somewhat of an art to determine what method is really the best for a given application or design goal. I've tried a few different ways to match this design. If your goal is to achieve maximum gain over a relatively narrow frequency range (+ or - 5% of the tuned frequency) a well designed gamma match has shown me the most gain so far.

Other matching networks could show improved bandwidth however, one would expect this to come at the slight expense of gain over the wider bandwidth. If the goal was to cover 10 and 11 meters and the loss in gain was a few tenths of a db, this would be excellent design practice. Someone that stays parked on one frequency might think otherwise.

My main question would be what are you trying to achieve by using other matching networks? Without knowing this, I can't even begin to speculate on how successful any variation in design would be. From just looking at this picture, there is one detail that you could change to improve performance in your project. Add the fourth radial to the coaxial cone.

Since the radiation currents on the radials are divided equally into the total number of radials, adding another will not increase the total amount of constructive radiation emitted from the cone. The fourth radial does a better job at confining the deconstructive currents that would be radiated from the bottom 1/4 wave of the vertical radiator.

 

[Marconi]

Looks like a "Christmas Tree" stand, or a foot for a tent pole to me.

I have questions.

How does the angle of that base part work out with the angle of the radials? Looks to be skewed a bit to me, or is it adjustable somehow?


You say this thing has four legs, but I only see three radials and three legs on the tent pole footing. How does that all work out again?

If this does connect the radials at the base of the antenna somehow will it have that cute little dog-leg appearance?

Do you think the added length will add a bit to the radial length and change the dynamic for the radial affect for the antenna?

Are you making the bottom section inside the cage double walled?

It looks to be rather small tubing diameter at this point in the antenna, I thought you might try to make it a bit stronger.

How about emailing me your Eznec5 model of this antenna, I might be able to help you out with some of my own ideas.

 

[MrSuburban]

Looks like a "Christmas Tree" stand, or a foot for a tent pole to me.


I guess it could be used for a christmas tree thanks Ill have to remember that, but it is made to screw into a puck mount on a vehicle

I have questions.

How does the angle of that base part work out with the angle of the radials? Looks to be skewed a bit to me, or is it adjustable somehow?

The base is just holding the antenna it doesnt have anything to do with the antenna other than a place to hold and work on

You say this thing has four legs, but I only see three radials and three legs on the tent pole footing. How does that all work out again?

You dont see alot of other things either the other element hasn't been put on yet. The picture was just to whet your whistle nothing more.



If this does connect the radials at the base of the antenna somehow will it have that cute little dog-leg appearance?

Has nothing to do with antenna

Do you think the added length will add a bit to the radial length and change the dynamic for the radial affect for the antenna?

Are you making the bottom section inside the cage double walled?

Yep


It looks to be rather small tubing diameter at this point in the antenna, I thought you might try to make it a bit stronger.


I don't think 1 3/8" was small, you are looking at the antenna upside down.


How about emailing me your Eznec5 model of this antenna, I might be able to help you out with some of my own ideas.

I am copying the Booty 4

 

[Marconi]

Oh! I get it now, it will be used on a mobile install. Your thinking makes sense now.

So your post of the 1/4 wave cage styled radiator was telling us what was on your mind earlier, and I thought you were trying to re-design the Vector. That will be interesting.

I'm sure now that you have modeled it, and I really would like to check out your Eznec5+ model. Maybe that is the model of the Suburban you first talked about a while back. I won't be picking on you now that I know you are serious, I just hope you'll stop all the double talk and maybe some of us can make sense of what you are saying at times.

Here is a somewhat similar idea kind of idea I think. This one appears not to need a matching device, but I would guess one might still be useful at dealing with a bit of reactance at resonance issues. This model use 4 92" Francis Amazer antennas I think and there was no radiator inside of the cage. IMO, this may have improved bandwidth a little by making the radiator look very big without adding the physical diameter necessary, but I don't see much advantage in the design. Seems I recall the book reference idea you posted the other day also didn't have a center radiator, except maybe a little bit above the hoop at the top of the cage, but I could be wrong on that.

 

[Marconi]

MrS, what do you expect this model idea to do for your mobile that an effective vertical 1/4 wave won't or can't do?

Thank goodness, finally got off of that page you posted with that big old wide picture. Why don't you figure out a way to resize your images. IMO, that would be great, cause I hate using the elevators to move around. Try right clicking on the image you want and see if resize is a function provided with your OP system or browzer. I know for sure that PhotoBucket will allow you to resize your images to fit better on forums.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

ok , lol , i need some clarification .........
is this pic ......

....... of your Intervector 10K sigma 4 type base antenna ?
or is it a big cone shaped 1/4 wave for a vehicle when stationary ?

 

[MrSuburban]

MrS, what do you expect this model idea to do for your mobile that an effective vertical 1/4 wave won't or can't do?

Thank goodness, finally got off of that page you posted with that big old wide picture. Why don't you figure out a way to resize your images. IMO, that would be great, cause I hate using the elevators to move around. Try right clicking on the image you want and see if resize is a function provided with your OP system or browzer. I know for sure that PhotoBucket will allow you to resize your images to fit better on forums.

Where are you getting the idea this is for a mobile? this thread is about the Vector.

What double talk are you referring to Marconi? I would like to address what ever you feel is double talk from me.

 

[Marconi]

Where are you getting the idea this is for a mobile? this thread is about the Vector.

What double talk are you referring to Marconi? I would like to address what ever you feel is double talk from me.

I think I got the idea it might be used on a mobile based on your words in the first sentence here: http://www.worldwidedx.com/cb-antennas/36412-modified-vector-4000-a-34.html#post284962

 

[MrSuburban]

I think I got the idea it might be used on a mobile based on your words in the first sentence here: http://www.worldwidedx.com/cb-antennas/36412-modified-vector-4000-a-34.html#post284962

Yes you commented about the stand, I gave a reply what it was actually used for...I also explained thru the reply where you still ask about it.

Marconi, you want to say I am double talking you just didn't understand what was written, I never made mention of a mobile and clearly stated it has nothing to do with antenna, it seems my friend maybe Cooter Mae needs to speak up. No Harm, No Foul they say


Here are the pertainent quotes from that post!!

Marconi: How does the angle of that base part work out with the angle of the radials? Looks to be skewed a bit to me, or is it adjustable somehow?

Mr S: The base is just holding the antenna it doesnt have anything to do with the antenna other than a place to hold and work on




Marconi: If this does connect the radials at the base of the antenna somehow will it have that cute little dog-leg appearance?

Mr S: Has nothing to do with antenna





Marconi: It looks to be rather small tubing diameter at this point in the antenna, I thought you might try to make it a bit stronger.


Mr S : I don't think 1 3/4" was small, you are looking at the antenna upside down.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

To keep this on topic i love my Modified Vector

what other antennas have you been able to compare it to at that location ?
were they at the same location and feed-point height ?
what modifications did you do to your vector ?
do you intend to try more modifications to your intervector 10k to get more performance ? or do you feel you've tweaked it to its full potential ?
can you share more pics of your antenna ?

thanks for sharing what you have about it so far

p.s. nice siggy

 

[HomerBB]

The last real project was a 4el yagi, and a 5/8 with short Sirio style radials which I found seriously lacking (low receive, poor DX performance compared to large GP 5/8) and took down. I have played with a vertical 1/2 wave Omni, but haven't figured out the matching section for an endfed non-radial antenna, yet. I do not want to put a plastic box at the base with a variable capacitor in it. Something more like the A99 or Imax has to minimize the size of the thing.

Beyond that, I am in the process of redoing my Vector (Qv4k) trying to beef it up and checking it against some of the info coming out in this thread lately and BM's Booty4 thread.