Range of an Antron-A99 antenna

[Captain Kilowatt]

And to further complicate matters we have a misuse of terms thrown in for good measure. there is no ground wave present above about 3 MHz so therefore ground wave contacts are not possible on 11m. All to many people refer to non-skywave propagation as ground wave. It is not. It is direct wave propagation. Ground wave propagation only exists below about 3 MHz as mentioned. Just figured since we're splitting hairs here we may as well split all of them.

 

[Lil'Yeshua]

I have a local CB'er that seems to think that if he keeps his Maco V58 close to the ground that his radio wave propagation hugs the ground and keeps on going. I didn't know that anything above 3 MHz isn't ground wave. As a matter if fact,pretty much everyone on 11 meters in my neck of the woods thinks they're doing ground wave at that magic height of around 30' or so. I have to get up above 37' just to clear an earthen embankment behind my house. I live where 1960's sand removal operations pit used to exist so the ground behind me slopes up at a 45 degree angle to the neighbor's land. Most of Charlotte,NC has been built with Pageland,SC sugar sand in concrete

 

[Mr Clean]

I have a local CB'er that seems to think that if he keeps his Maco V58 close to the ground that his radio wave propagation hugs the ground and keeps on going. I didn't know that anything above 3 MHz isn't ground wave. As a matter if fact,pretty much everyone on 11 meters in my neck of the woods thinks they're doing ground wave at that magic height of around 30' or so. I have to get up above 37' just to clear an earthen embankment behind my house. I live where 1960's sand removal operations pit used to exist so the ground behind me slopes up at a 45 degree angle to the neighbor's land. Most of Charlotte,NC has been built with Pageland,SC sugar sand in concrete

Higher the better for local. Ive heard you can go to high but I would think that would be a 3 mile high tower lol.

 

[IMD262]

And to further complicate matters we have a misuse of terms thrown in for good measure. there is no ground wave present above about 3 MHz so therefore ground wave contacts are not possible on 11m. All to many people refer to non-skywave propagation as ground wave. It is not. It is direct wave propagation. Ground wave propagation only exists below about 3 MHz as mentioned. Just figured since we're splitting hairs here we may as well split all of them.

Groundwave does occur at 11M, but it is it's distance can only be measured in feet/meters ....not miles/KM.

 

[Lil'Yeshua]

Groundwave does occur at 11M, but it is it's distance can only be measured in feet/meters ....not miles/KM.

How does that work for only feet?
http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php?action=printpage;topic=26197.0
http://psc.suijs.info/proptutorial1.htm
http://www.arrl-sc.org/Documents/Radio Wave Propagation.ppt

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

Groundwave does occur at 11M, but it is it's distance can only be measured in feet/meters ....not miles/KM.

Touché. Another hair split. I figure that when you can shout further than the ground wave travels you can pretty much discount groundwave being a propagation factor.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

How does that work for only feet?
http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php?action=printpage;topic=26197.0 link contain misuse of the term ground wave


Propagation Service Center - Propagation Tutorial link contain misuse of the term ground wave. They even reference the FM broadcast band using ground wave at 100 MHz. Not so,

http://www.arrl-sc.org/Documents/Radio%20Wave%20Propagation.ppt Link is missing info at least it was on my PC when I opened it.

Try this link. Ground wave propagation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Again, most people call non-skywave propagation ground wave which it is not. true ground wave propagation is what determines the coverage of an AM brioadcast station and the losses increase with frequency. The most coveted AM frequencies are those low in the band like 550KHz as they have a much better coverage area than a station with the same power on 1550KHz for example. It is no coincidence that the local stations are assigned higher in the band.

 

[M0GVZ]

And to further complicate matters we have a misuse of terms thrown in for good measure. there is no ground wave present above about 3 MHz

Utter rubbish.

http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/p/R-REC-P.368-7-199203-S!!PDF-E.pdf

 

[M0GVZ]

Touché. Another hair split. I figure that when you can shout further than the ground wave travels you can pretty much discount groundwave being a propagation factor.

In other words you don't actually know what you're talking about which comes as no surprise given you think you need to ground a dipole antenna

I would stop giving advice about antennas until you've gone and done some reading and learnt something.

 

[IMD262]

In other words you don't actually know what you're talking about which comes as no surprise given you think you need to ground a dipole antenna

I would stop giving advice about antennas until you've gone and done some reading and learnt something.

The Chairman of Garth's overseas fanclub ???

 

[Road Squawker]

Utter rubbish.

http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/p/R-REC-P.368-7-199203-S!!PDF-E.pdf

I'll call your rubbish,........... and raise you a direct wave**Jump_im**


most of what CB'ers here call "ground wave" is really "direct wave"

 

[W5LZ]

Pssst... Conner, he really does know more than you think he does. Yes, you can 'ground' a dipole or any 'balanced' antenna. It isn't done the 'conventional' way like with verticals, but it's certainly do-able. It isn't an 'RF' ground, but a safety ground.
- 'Doc

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

Utter rubbish.

http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/p/R-REC-P.368-7-199203-S!!PDF-E.pdf

I can't comment on that right now as I am at eork on my phone and cannot see it very well on the tiny screen. It will have to wait a day or so until I get home on the PC.

In other words you don't actually know what you're talking about which comes as no surprise given you think you need to ground a dipole antenna

I would stop giving advice about antennas until you've gone and done some reading and learnt something.

Be carefull making false accusations. I may be inclined to call you an asshole and decide later if the accusation was false or not. You have NO idea what I know or do not know. Let me just say that I know enough to have spent 22 years as a commercial broadcast engineer running a network of AM/FM radio stations. You don't stay in that business long blowing smoke out your ass. As for grounding a dipole.....where did I say that. Show me. I mentioned to someone to not rely on his mast sitting in a piece of pipe in the ground to be grounded. The intent was for a LIGHTNING ground. I realize you have been a ham since 2009 but you have a few things to learn as well in addition to manners. Personally I got my advanced ticket in 1989, 20 years before you, and at that time I had been in the broadcast business for a couple years. I suggest you do a little more research i.to TRUE ground wave propagation rather than grab the first piece of info that agrees with your way of thinking. If the proper terms are used it is WELL documented that ground wave propagation is almost nonexistent at 5 Mhz and 3 Mhz is considered the practicable limit.

 

[nosepc]

Groundwave does occur at 11M, but it is it's distance can only be measured in feet/meters ....not miles/KM.

error

I do nightly contacts within 200 kms with 12watts

22 hours after many years.

Buenos Aires-Gualeguaychu-Paysandu-Fray Bentos and more cities.

and that is not spatial wave has no qsb,

the signal is weak, but sustainedwith clear audio.

nosepc :blush:

 

[Lil'Yeshua]

Try this link. Ground wave propagation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Again, most people call non-skywave propagation ground wave which it is not. true ground wave propagation is what determines the coverage of an AM brioadcast station and the losses increase with frequency. The most coveted AM frequencies are those low in the band like 550KHz as they have a much better coverage area than a station with the same power on 1550KHz for example. It is no coincidence that the local stations are assigned higher in the band.

Thanks for the link. That answers a lot. The area I live in is a 2 with sandy soil. Dry in top but moist several inches down. Direct wave and ionization layer bent Comunications it is then.