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bjpell

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Jan 11, 2009
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I will first warn you that I am a little emotional over what I have to say in this post :sad: and that my spelling and grammar are not great, but If you have either positive/negative criticism, or can relate to my situation, or can suggest what my next step should be I would greatly appreciate it. :wink:

The story…
{Recruiting new people, & studding for the test }

When I told my friends that I was studying and reading books about ham radio It gave me the opportunity to try and explain what it was to them. Well they laughed at me when I told them what I was doing. Well, I tried to explain the importance of ham radio and how ham WAS UESD with Katrina. I tried to get them interested by talking about satellites and talking to astronauts in the international space station but I failed. Instead they made fun of me saying I was trying to contact E.T. and such.
They said, “why when we have cell phones that: are on the internet, text, have color screens, and cameras in them, that can do almost anything a radio can do. You also can both talk at the same time and hear each other. If were in a state of emergency like when hurricane Katarina hit and it gets bad enough that cell towers don’t work you’re probably screwed anyway so why get a ham license?”
So I ignored them over my Christmas break from college, and studied for my upcoming test I was excited about taking. :D :thumbup:

{Test day}

Went to the local library here this last Saturday morning and took the exam. After I passed my technician exam I asked the test administrator guys (5 of them) who were all sitting at the main table if anyone could teach me how to use a hand held radio. I said that I have no friends, family, or anyone I know that has a ham license so I could use someone to teach me how to do this and mentor me through it for a few minutes. They all stared at me for a few seconds until the guy in charge said:
"We are thinking on starting a new technician class to teach newbie’s like you how it works, but as of now we don't offer anything like that yet".
I said well I was wondering if someone could just show me today, or even tomorrow how to do this, because I’m on my own here and totally new to this. I could use help picking a first radio, and how to use one too.
Nobody, not one of them (who by the way each of them had a ht on their side) offered to show me how to use a radio.
I was shocked. :shock: I was speechless for about 10 seconds until I showed them a picture of the VX-7R and the 8R in a magizeen and asked if they would suggest one or the other for a beginner. He said:
It’s like buying a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge; they are all the same really.
I said all the Yaesu radios are all about the same??? I got no response so I said thanks and left.

{Discouraged} :(

I’m still shocked. No wonder why this is a slowly dying group of enthusiasts over the last what…15 years or so. They aren’t willing to show a new guy the ropes. I’m 28, I showed serious interest, and was shot down by the local guys who represented 3-4 different local groups/clubs that they were trying to solicit membership for before we took our tests. After being ridiculed by my friends and getting no support from the local club/senior hams in my area, I’m almost done trying to learn this hobby. Where is the support for a newbie?:headbang Is my experience the norm? Is this how it usually goes?


Your thoughts/ suggestions/ comments/ ideas are appreciated.

-=ben
 

You and I are in similar boats - so to speak. I have never operated a Ham radio - and I have a General license - too! Reason? I didn't want to talk illegally/improperly so I waited to get the licenses. It is better to understand the finer ponts that your license permits you, than to go on talk and have the Amatuer Auxillary warn you of frequency use violations. Ham is a tight group and are very picky about what happens on air. After all, in case of a national emergency - or even a locel one - you may be NEEDED to carry out operations and procedures from your station to helo in the relief aid of any distressed area. That is why the rule of 'able to use any frequency or radio regardless of licensing'. But if licensed and trained in contesting, you will be 'tune in' - so to speak - of running a station and using triangulating techniques in the worst of circumstances in order to discover/locate rogue stations throwing strong carrier waves/jamnning these frequencies. Or, being able to operate a station when power and utilities are unavailable to help in a relief effort - just to name a few reasons.

As much as seasoned Hams ('oxymoron deluxe'-lol!) may hate CB radios, these radios are just as capable of doing the same thing in similar ways and are just as valuable. HAms throw more power output and know good station practices that are probably more adept to be able to do conduct aid, so get used to the idea that this concept is a part and responsibillity of that license. Do you have a CB station and know how to operate it? Get a cheap setup; there are many of us on this site that have some gear for sale that will work fo r you just fine. The rules for CB operation isn't nearly as strict or monitored as Ham is - so have fun on CB. That is - if you never did that either! Have you ever had to help someone out and used a cellphone or a radio to do it?

But all of this doesn't help you or I one single bit - huh? We BOTH have to find a Ham and ask him how to use it properly. In reality. Hams are RESPONSIBLE to help out other Hams operate their station correctly. It is a voluntary compliance thing. Drive thru your neighborhood and find a house with a Ham antenna on it and be aggressively polite and explain your dilemma. That is what I'm going to do, as I know of at least three Hams in my neighborhood. Surely, one can take the time to explain how to use the radio and answer questions on using repeaters, how to call out, and change radio functions. Besides, Hams - liike CB'ers - are 'ratchet jaws' and will probably chat your ear off if you give them a chance to talk about their hobby and what they like to do with it. Take some courage man, and be polite and TRY AGAIN!
 
Ben,
Oh, I don't think I would be too discouraged.
Comparison of ham radio and cell phone use is a bit meaningless, they are not the same things at all sort of (that cell phone is just another form of radio). Ham radio, or CB radio for that matter, can be a 'stand-alone' type thingy. If you've got power, a transceiver, and an antenna, you are on the air. Cell phones have at least one more 'step' in that process, they require a cell tower facility to relay signals and a switching network to do the connecting. Ham or CB radio doesn't require that.
So a cell phone user can talk and listen at the same time. Since when does that make any difference is you are trying to transfer information? Seems it would be more of a hindrance than not.
Texting. Also called RTTY. Sending pictures. Either SSTV or FSTV or fax. Digital communications, how about PSK, packet, etc. All of them, modes in use in amateur radio for lots of years. A connection to the internet? Already been done. And the best part, as far as I'm concerned, I don't get a bill for using a radio that 'they' get for using a cell phone. Can't connect where I'm at? Change bands, not cellphone services.
Why wouldn't one of those guys teach you about using an HT? I honestly don't know. Maybe because they aren't all that sure? That'd be my excuse, cuz I'm not! (I ain't thrilled with them, big deal.) By the way, a HT makes probably the worst 'first' radio anyone can get. They are not simple, they are limited in use, and how the @#$$ do you not press more than one button at a time!? Maybe that's why I'm not thrilled with them?
Something you might think about when you think ham radio is in decline, is that it -IS- a limited resource. Where would you squeeze in several thousand more hams? (Or CB'ers on the CB band?) Take turns? Oh, Yeah! Sure, right. Wanna make a little wager on that?? (Please don't take me up on that, I really don't like taking advantage of someone.)
So your friends aren't all that interested in radio stuff? That's okay. Are you interested in ALL their interests? I doubt it. And it did take you a while to get interested in it, didn't it? Patience, Grasshopper...
- 'Doc

Oh! 'google' around for a users group for any particular radio you might be interested in. There are bunches of them on the internet.
 
I think what Doc said makes a lot of sense. My first thoughts about the instructors and the HT was that they may have thought that an Amateur HT is a lot more complicated to explain real quick as compared to say a hand held CB . There are a lot of little combination of buttons to make things happen and each HT is different . So I wouldn't take it to heart .
 
!!!

Hello,
I feel your pain.

I have been into radio for many years now, and have never gotten so far as to actually take the test. I have run into some of the same problems as you. My advice is to get online and find some local clubs, as I did, and bug the hell out of them till you finally find a person who is really into the spirit of ham radio. I shotgunned emails, and after quite a while, two people finally took me seriously. I am going to the local ham fest this following weekend to meet these guys, and starting classes in two weeks to prepare for my testing. :thumbup1: But I have been trying for quite a while to connect to someone helpful, and I almos gave up once again, till I recieved the emails, one took almost two monthes to respond.

Dont give up if you really want it, and remember the earlier advice about getting help here and on other web sites. (Just dont be gullible.)
 
I remember the first time I showed up at the local club on Field Day the guys spent all kinds of time showing me things and letting me operate the big radios they had set up . That was my first real hands on experience of seeing what all you could do with Amateur radio. It was pretty neat . This club is very active in the community. One thing that caught the attention of the younger crowd during a community event was a Code Reader and radios the club demonstrated. The young people were fascinated by that. One thing different with cell phones is that that form of communication is pretty much limited to just the concept of limited communication. Amateur Radio is experimental and hobby oriented and I don't have to know the person on the other end to have a conversation about anything. I think this generation has lost the concept of "hobby" . When I was a kid hobbies were a big thing. From stamp and coin collecting to flying airplanes and Estes Rockets and crystal radio sets . Hobbies always brought the sense of adventure and fun . So don't be discouraged about the lack of understanding of your friends. Their concept of "hobby" may be limited to video games and television . :)
 
Very long story, made very short.

No family into ham radio, before the internet, no friends into ham radio...back in the 80's, I finally found a class to teach the code and get people ready for the test.

The old bastards giving the class were pretty much monsters. I got chewed out for being a CBer before my door even closed on my truck the first time I pulled up for class. The codgers kept running on at the mouth the whole class and I finally had enough of it and told them to shove it.

It took me 20yrs to finally get back around to getting my ticket.

I regret letting my temper get to me and miss the time I could have been on the air, particularly missing out on the infancy and boom time of packet radio....that would have been right up my alley.

The moral of the story is, there are a lot of social retards in the hobby who don't have any clue about how to communicate with people. Don't let them discourage you. They will all die off eventually as my particular group did and likely you won't even need to deal with them on the air.

Just 'do it' for you and you'll find your way on your own. Patience is the key and with the internet now, if you just poke around google long enough, you can find explanations of almost anything there is that is ham related.

Monitor any local repeaters you can and try and meet new people that way. Search out any other clubs in the area. The guys you were exposed to may not even fairly represent other members.

As for the handhelds....fundamentally they all do the same thing, but in the details, all the added features, they vary a lot. Frankly, I think a mobile/base is a lot better idea. You can reach a lot more people that way and will make a lot more use of it than a handheld most likely. I hardly use my handheld now. I'm pretty much either mobile or base.

The best actual performers are the single band models. This is because the filtering in the receive is designed specifically for one band use. The simpler dual-band models follow, like the FT-60 as they don't have as many crazy wide band receive features in them.

The radios like the VX7R (that I own) have poorer performance due to design constraints trying to cram so many bands and wide band receive into a single radio that doesn't cost $5k and is small. The other side is, they work well as a scanner/receiver for other uses and they have very flexible options for arranging memory banks etc.

All of them fundamentally need the following to work on a repeater.

1) Be in range of the repeater ;-)
2) Input frequency of the repeater
3) Output frequency of the repeater
Sometimes you can just program the output with the automatic +/- offset taking care of the input for you....your radio manual will explain and the local repeater has to be on the standard offset to work.
4) PL tone - You might need to send a tone encoding on transmit to get 'into' the repeater/machine and you can if the repeater passes that tone, use the tone to open the squelch to receive on your side of the conversation too. Your manual should show you how to set the PL or CTCSS tone if needed (around here (NJ) most repeaters require a tone to get into the machine and about 1/3 pass a tone on the output too)
 
I was on my own back in 1959 as far as radio goes, and there weren't any VHF/UHF HTs available. So with my novice license and SX-99 receiver, and an ARRL Handbook, I built a 50-watt (input, which was probably 30 watts output), single crystal transmitter. I got the information out of a book; there was no Internet, cell phones or anything like that back then.

My point? It's up to you, not everybody else. I, personally, don't carry an HT with me wherever I go. I do have a couple of them, and I have radios in my two cars and one at home.

As far as Kenwood/Icom/Yaesu radios, they ARE all basically the same thing. Controls in different locations, bells and whistles might be different from brand to brand and model to model, but they are basically radios, and they basically do what radios basically are supposed to do.

Again: it's up to you.
 
Welcome to the forum bjpell. Your situation is not all that uncommon, unfortunately. Ham radio is just like anything else: there are a lot of good people and also a lot of jerks and you just have to wade through it all to find those whose personality meshes with your own. I've had help from a few people over the years and also had to do a lot on my own and I'm certainly no expert on anything.

This is one of the reasons that motivates me to keep this site going, and it's why we have a lot of great contributors. Feel free to ask any questions you like. We (the collective forum) may not have all the answers, but we certainly do the best we can. Who knows, maybe in a bit, you'll be the guy answering questions for the new guys.

BTW, did you already buy an HT or are you still trying to decide?
 
BJPELL,
Welcome to one of the best forums on the net.
For what it's worth iv'e been licensed for 14+ years i don't belong to my local club due to the fact that they are very cliquey, the only time i see them is during storm spotter training and they don't speak to you. This summer I recieved a letter in the mail stating that i should at least join the club or refrain from using the repeater, so i don't. The funny thing is the only people i have ever talked to on it was other people that would not join their club. or down at the superfest every year. I belong to a club 30 miles away where they welcome everyone and have a new ham class every year to teach new people the basics. It's pretty bad when there are more people from here in the club 30 miles away than they have in their club. So don't give up look around you will find a decent club or someone to "elmer" you. Besides you have found one of the best place on the net to get help.:thumbup:
 
You're missing the point. To be indoctinated into hamdome, you must first pass these initial tests.

Just wait till you get on the air for some real hazing...

People are people and there are all kinds in every walk of life. You just got caught up with "those" people. Find some that you like, either one's that are already into the hobby and your needs, or ones that you can bring with you.

If it's not that important to you, then find something else.

Now, if I had been there, I would have shown you everything I know about my HT (it's a rather simple device), and probably try to find out what you want or expect from ham radio.
 
Hey..

I think the Most Important thing is..
Congrats...You passed..

HT's are cool (personally i prefer the Icoms)
But i also agree a mobile base is likely the best way to start

I started with the good ole Icom 706 MKIIG

Forget the dummies who refused to give you even the simplest advice.
There are many dummies in every hobby.
Ham radio seems to have way more then its fair share.

However Ham radio is well worth the effort .

Now it is Great you found this site/forum
It is by FAR among the best out there.
A lot of really good people on here

We are Always glad to try to answer any questions
Regardless if it is about ham radio..CB..GMRS-FRS..MURS ( does not matter)
This forum is simply about how to best use 2 way communications for hobby as well as for more important reasons..

Welcome aboard.
 
Rob KI6USW said:
You and I are in similar boats - so to speak. I have never operated a Ham radio - and I have a General license - too! Reason? I didn't want to talk illegally/improperly so I waited to get the licenses. It is better to understand the finer ponts that your license permits you, than to go on talk and have the Amatuer Auxillary warn you of frequency use violations. Ham is a tight group and are very picky about what happens on air. After all, in case of a national emergency - or even a locel one - you may be NEEDED to carry out operations and procedures from your station to helo in the relief aid of any distressed area. That is why the rule of 'able to use any frequency or radio regardless of licensing'. But if licensed and trained in contesting, you will be 'tune in' - so to speak - of running a station and using triangulating techniques in the worst of circumstances in order to discover/locate rogue stations throwing strong carrier waves/jamnning these frequencies. Or, being able to operate a station when power and utilities are unavailable to help in a relief effort - just to name a few reasons.

As much as seasoned Hams ('oxymoron deluxe'-lol!) may hate CB radios, these radios are just as capable of doing the same thing in similar ways and are just as valuable. HAms throw more power output and know good station practices that are probably more adept to be able to do conduct aid, so get used to the idea that this concept is a part and responsibillity of that license. Do you have a CB station and know how to operate it? Get a cheap setup; there are many of us on this site that have some gear for sale that will work fo r you just fine. The rules for CB operation isn't nearly as strict or monitored as Ham is - so have fun on CB. That is - if you never did that either! Have you ever had to help someone out and used a cellphone or a radio to do it?

But all of this doesn't help you or I one single bit - huh? We BOTH have to find a Ham and ask him how to use it properly. In reality. Hams are RESPONSIBLE to help out other Hams operate their station correctly. It is a voluntary compliance thing. Drive thru your neighborhood and find a house with a Ham antenna on it and be aggressively polite and explain your dilemma. That is what I'm going to do, as I know of at least three Hams in my neighborhood. Surely, one can take the time to explain how to use the radio and answer questions on using repeaters, how to call out, and change radio functions. Besides, Hams - liike CB'ers - are 'ratchet jaws' and will probably chat your ear off if you give them a chance to talk about their hobby and what they like to do with it. Take some courage man, and be polite and TRY AGAIN!
Click to expand...

Thanks, that was exactly what I needed to hear! My new radio, VX-8r arrives tomorrow, and I plan on spending the day (school was canceled due to inclement weather) monitoring and learning how to program it and such. Thanks again.
 

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