Wilson antenna advice

[The DB]

Alright, I just had an epiphany slopping through the mud feeding horses and looking up at my antenna for it's daily visual.

I don't think it's arguable that a shorter antenna needs inductive reactance to cancel the capacitive reactance. The shorter the antenna the larger the coil in "henries".

Yes

When the comparison of identical height and larger coils was brought up, I was thinking larger coil in "weight" or surface area.

Yes, the shorter the antenna the more "henries" or inductive reactance you need to compensate.

So it would seem that more henries would be more lossy, while more weight would be less lossy.

Now I'm really confused :sneaky2:

Looks like you got it to me, where is the confusion?


The DB

 

[GnG8d]

Looks like you got it to me, where is the cinfusion?

If 2 antennas are identical in height (= capacitive reactance) and require the same amount of inductance but use physically different coils, which will be more efficient?

I'm guessing the coil with the more surface area, but then again the magnetic flux set up doesn't require the additional surface area .......... or does it?

 

[Nick23]

A predator is the better antenna. The coil is bigger, more surface area to travel on. The coil is mid loaded, always better than base loaded. If you are running power the coil design is better for heat dissipation. Also, I believe the whip is stronger and you can hit stuff without wrecking the antenna.

Please feel free to correct me, if I'm wrong.

 

[Nick23]

The Sirio definitely beats the Wilson. The Predator 10-K vs Sirio, no comparison. The two best antennas on the market today are 102 whip and the 10-k. The performance with these two is very close, some even claim the 10-k offers better receive. That's just what I've heard, don't get on me if its wrong.

 

[Nick23]

Oh and the Predator is cheaper than the Sirio or Wilson. The 102 is the cheapest of all though.

 

[W5LZ]

A short 'fat' coil is more efficient than a tall 'skinny' one. Carry that tall/skinny to the extreme and you have a helically wound antenna. Those types of antennas are less efficient (Francis, for example?). Howz that for confusing... but still true.
- 'Doc

 

[M0GVZ]

The Sirio definitely beats the Wilson. The Predator 10-K vs Sirio, no comparison. The two best antennas on the market today are 102 whip and the 10-k. The performance with these two is very close, some even claim the 10-k offers better receive. That's just what I've heard, don't get on me if its wrong.

I think that's an accurate summary. The point I made was I don't think that the differences between the Sirio, the 10k and the whip are significant enough to go and buy a new antenna if you already own one of those, the gain being maybe a couple of dB at best, less than a S point between them. Far better if you own either of those three antennas spending a day doing bonding, changing to a fixed mount, optimising what you've got. You'll get that extra couple of dB and then some and it'll cost you w whole lot less than buying another antenna.

My friend with his Sirio 3000 has no trouble doing 60 miles mobile to base with 50W and 30miles mobile to mobile over flat ground on 4W. He could go up to a Performer 5000 but the difference would be negligible.

 

[GnG8d]

And the 10k increases modulation 30%

 

[hotrod]

I think that's an accurate summary. The point I made was I don't think that the differences between the Sirio, the 10k and the whip are significant enough to go and buy a new antenna if you already own one of those, the gain being maybe a couple of dB at best, less than a S point between them. Far better if you own either of those three antennas spending a day doing bonding, changing to a fixed mount, optimising what you've got. You'll get that extra couple of dB and then some and it'll cost you w whole lot less than buying another antenna.

My friend with his Sirio 3000 has no trouble doing 60 miles mobile to base with 50W and 30miles mobile to mobile over flat ground on 4W. He could go up to a Performer 5000 but the difference would be negligible.

i have to agree with this. i used a wilson 5k ,sirio z180 , monkeymade mm9.
mm9= worked very well kept up with thetaller sirio but was narrow banded
sirio z180=worked flawless and covered more freq. range
wilson 5k worked good but as good as the first two. antenna was narrowbanded also
mm9 advantages were it handled more watts and was about 6 inches shorter than the sirio
mm9 disadvantages were it was heavy and required a tri pad mag mount or puck mount
btween them all i felt the sirio had the best of everything i wanted in a antenna
but id ya want/need a antenna that will handle mega watts the open coil is the way to go
i know this isnt a 10k review but i dont own a 10k and this should be close to results
you,ll see

 

[boomer111]

Most of this discussion is above my pay grade.

I was always concerned with low standing wave while I was running the amp.

Whichever antenna I ran be it the Wilson bottom load of the 10K I always got satisfactory results with communication.

For me the thing that I could test with the 259B was swr over bandwidth.

For this the 10K gave better results.

And with the coil being up (in my case 22 inches) I am thinking I have better working antenna.

I also think that I do receive better with the 10K on the roof of the 4Runner than the Wilson 1000.

The 1/4 wave whip is just out of the question while being mobile. Just to hard to keep the swr stable while moving and then there is the height question being problematic.

Wilson 1000/5000 is a good antenna for a radio only station. With the amp I like the 10K more.

Now being retired I am pretty much on only one channel now so the bandwidth isn't as important as when I was driving the big rig 12-14 hours a day. Lots more stations to talk with while behind the wheel.

I could go with the base loaded Wilson now I suppose and still be happy...but the 10k is the better antenna. With the coil antenna the signal power is radiated above the coil so the signal is a little bit higher for better transmit capabilities.

At least this is how I remember it, I haven't really been (into RF) for some time.

Correct me if I am off base here, but I will still forget!!

 

[22racer]

I now have a Siro 5000 turbo in plAce of my wilson 5000 both mag mount. Hevent used it long enough to say for sure which is "better". But I will say this. The Siro seems a little more broadbanded, which is to be expected since its physical length is a little longer. The magnet is a little different too. The Siro magnet is larger but It doesnt seem to be as strong as the Wilsons. Still strong enough I suppose, it has withstood 80mph with no issue. Grounding might be better with the larger surface area, but I really cant say.

 

[W5LZ]

Antenna length has nothing to do with 'broadbandedness'. I can have a lot to do with efficient radiation.
Which will be 'better' -for your particular situation-? Beats me, you tell us!
- 'Doc

 

[GnG8d]

I'm sure the Sirio is a great antenna, but all of the comments saying "better" and "more broad banded" in the same sentence just has me confused.

It's great that there is an alternative to the Wilson however. I must have bought the couple of Wilsons' I used before the Barjan era, because I never had a problem with mine when I ran mobile.

 

[22racer]

Ok so what I meant was.... I gained bandwidth without giving up efficiency and possiby gained efficiency by giving up the "convenience of being short" factor. Being that I dont tx outside the 11m band I dont guess its that big a deal for me. In short I have a low SWR over a wider range with the Siro.

 

[GnG8d]

I gained bandwidth without giving up efficiency and possiby gained efficiency

I guess that's the part I'm having trouble understanding.