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Johnson Messenger 2 Has Feedback Coming Thru Its Speaker? Video.
- Thread starter Eastside
- Start date
No I did not clean the relay.....suppose I should spray it...but it sounded like it was opening nd closing.
Yes they do have a vibrator tube.....I am not familier with these radios but was told they had a vibrator tube....where is it located?
Edit....yup the big can in the back is the vibrator.
The relay has a plastic cover i think they designed to never come off.
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First you need to make sure that the tone alert jumper plug is plugged in because this brings audio signals to the modulator from other circuits inside the unit. if this is missing or not wired right, not connecting right, etc this can give you problems as it completes the audio and squelch circuits for this unit. There appears to be some capacitors on the plug as well (I dont have or own a M2). Then you need to crack that plastic housing open if you cant get it apart and clean the relay. You might have to break it apart or use a pair of sharp wire cutters and work at it getting the plastic off until you can get to the contacts. This whole M2 unit is controlled through the relay so this is a vital area and dirty contacts could give you the problem(s) your having, I have seen it before. Just because its making clicking noises doesn't mean its working (contacting) properly when it most likely has oxidation on the contacts and they are probably black! (like EVERY radio I have worked on that is from the 60's or 70's). Also, spray the tube pins and sockets as well inside with electronics cleaner. The tubes to check are V10 (12AU7), V5 (6AW8), and V6 (12AB5). These are the tubes for the volume and audio circuit/modulator and could in relations to this issue. If the tubes are replaced with known good ones, then you have many other variables at hand, such as inter-stage coupling capacitors, series audio resistors or other possible issues from the power supply as others have pointed out. Have you checked that it is putting out any power and is on frequency? This should be easy to fix as I know this radio quite well from the schematics and have the service manual. Since the radio is roughly 48-50 years old, there are many potential variables with troubleshooting issues at this age now.
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I sprayed the relay contacts with cleaner and checked a bunch of stuff.....checked all the tubes.....V9 is between good/bad....V1 and V2 both weak...didnt see any burned or damaged caps or resistors.....made a tube chart......tracing wiring until my head hurt....ha ha
you need to replace all those tubes, and also V3 and V4 (IF stage tubes), might as well. V9 is the rectifier (B+) tube so that could be your problem right there..... cant perform to task for the AF/TX circuit demands and voltage is probably dropping/not-stabilizing and giving you the problems. So, if this unit is clean enough for you to invest your time and money into, then replace those tubes first with all known good working ones first and it sounds like it could be more than likely the fix (and if not by any means then come back here and we can get more in-depth), however once that is done you need to still replace caps/resistors etc..... Tube radios are ticking time bombs, they slowly burn up and wear out like cars/women do.
BJ radionut
Supporting Member and 6m addict
Ok: Hope this helps:
First: It not uncommon for V9 (12BW4) to test good-bad. This is the Rectifier Tube for the high voltage. I remember these testing good and being bad, and the reverse test weak to poor and still function ok. Some of that is due to the difference in the tube tester (style/brand) used.
Best options: Purchase a solid state replacement or replace with diodes wired to a tube base or the tubes socket.
Second: V1...6BJ6...RF amplifer....replace 6BJ6A
V2...12BE6...Mixer Stage....replace 12BE6A
Next: CD is right that the 12 pin plug (P10 on diagram/Tone Alert) located on the back (this is the male plug) which pushes into the female receptacle, must be wired correctly or your going to have "issues" so confirm this is correct.
Keep plugging away you'l get it going.
Best mic I found for those was the old Blue Turner Plus II
All the Best
Gary
That Cap off the V9 base the 80uf-450v...needs to go certainly! I would go slightly higher in value than 80uf but certainly not lower...
First: It not uncommon for V9 (12BW4) to test good-bad. This is the Rectifier Tube for the high voltage. I remember these testing good and being bad, and the reverse test weak to poor and still function ok. Some of that is due to the difference in the tube tester (style/brand) used.
Best options: Purchase a solid state replacement or replace with diodes wired to a tube base or the tubes socket.
Second: V1...6BJ6...RF amplifer....replace 6BJ6A
V2...12BE6...Mixer Stage....replace 12BE6A
Next: CD is right that the 12 pin plug (P10 on diagram/Tone Alert) located on the back (this is the male plug) which pushes into the female receptacle, must be wired correctly or your going to have "issues" so confirm this is correct.
Keep plugging away you'l get it going.
Best mic I found for those was the old Blue Turner Plus II
All the Best
Gary
That Cap off the V9 base the 80uf-450v...needs to go certainly! I would go slightly higher in value than 80uf but certainly not lower...
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BJ radionut
Supporting Member and 6m addict
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5336136228&icep_item=400422565758
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5336136228&icep_item=160117817277
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5336136228&icep_item=161900521651
Couple sources for what your looking for;
K5SVC : Tube Guy...top self / good man to deal with...
Gary
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5336136228&icep_item=160117817277
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5336136228&icep_item=161900521651
Couple sources for what your looking for;
K5SVC : Tube Guy...top self / good man to deal with...
Gary
Use 100uf/450v as the value for power supply replacement cap, also I do the same thing for the browning and trams, boost them up from 40mf to 100mf. In actuality, those stock 40uf browning/tram can caps measure a little higher, around 50uf each cap section on my LCR meter.
Thanks guys...I appreciate the help.
Are u guys talking about that huge paper cap next to the transformer?
The cap can I was referring to is in the browning and trams, it is 3 caps in those units and not worth the expense when you can get 3 separate caps for much cheaper.
Yes the large paper cap, it should be 80uf/450vdc, replace that with a new 100uf/450vdc.
Well, is it a newer style aluminum capacitor? estimate how old is it? if its another paper cap and just as old as that radio, like a pull from something else, then that might not be the best idea, but a aluminum cap would be better in place than that paper cap so since you have it on hand, if you have a lcr meter then you could check to see the real value. I would swap it out (if its a newer cap), as it probably has a slightly higher value than the original paper cap does. I have tested a vast number of capacitors I have pulled from tube radios restorations from the 1960's era and most of them are 25-70% out of tolerance. The average is about 35-40% from what I seen. yeah replace that cap with 80uf or higher, I prefer to use 100uf for all my cap change outs for the high voltage power supply B+ rails as they are a more common value for a brand new replacement part from mouser and will help the unit perform a touch better, I noticed less noise and reduced hum (pretty much gone, it was bad with the stock cap cans) on my titan 2 from my internal speaker when I upped the cap values from 47uf to 100uf, but since yours is a 80mf cap you probably wont notice any change if you changed it out to a single 100uf/450v like I did because I changed (3) 40mf caps, so I added 159uf capacitance (spec wise, real world it was like around 150uf when I measured) in comparison to you only adding additional 20mf if you go up to a 100uf from where you are at. If you have room you could fit in (2) 100uf's, this could be beneficial as I found out on other radios. I have never used a M2 personally, I don't know how bad (if any) any of the hums/noise coming from speaker, etc, please enlighten me is it a noisy radio like the titan 2 can be?
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