New thread to debate V-4000

[nosepc]

They say the 4000 is an antenna VECTOR type "open sleeve", then show as an example this drawing..

In 1st place, the VECTOR 4000 is a mass power, as a J-pole!!!

http://www.nevadaradio.co.uk/amateur-radio/antennas/base-antennas/sirio-new-vector-4000 (Type: 3/4 wave coaxial J-pole)

http://www.sirioantenne.it/prodotti...TOR+4000&idc=1008171241&idg=1008171169&idp=66 (3/4 λ coaxial J-pole)

not isolated.

which is similar that the Vector 4000??*

NOTHING!

"The SIGMA Vector 4000 is an antenna type open sleeve"

bullshit

PROVE IT

Each of the "evidence" presented to support what they say, it is very easy and simple to refute them, because they are based on FANTASY





All they do is attack me personally, because it is impossible scientifically refute my arguments.

 

[gt40425hp]

beyond all the arguing is there someone who makes a good heavy duty version of the sigma 4 these days

i have had 3 of them in the past that got tore up in storms and without a doubt is the best omni ever

 

[Robb]

beyond all the arguing is there someone who makes a good heavy duty version of the sigma 4 these days

i have had 3 of them in the past that got tore up in storms and without a doubt is the best omni ever

The Sirio Vector 4000 like the Sigma 4 can be secured at the middle of the radiator by using dacron guy rope. Many Ham verticals antennas that are not much longer than the Sigma 4 are secured in the same way, as this is a common issue.

 

[bob85]

"I see your only argument is to discredit me, but can not refute my assertions"

i do refute EVERYTHING you have posted since you joined the forum,
not one of your posts has any truth at all,



have a nice day

 

[nosepc]

"I see your only argument is to discredit me, but can not refute my assertions"

i do refute EVERYTHING you have posted since you joined the forum,
not one of your posts has any truth at all,



have a nice day

evidence to "demonstrate" the performance of the Vector 4000



the drawings are absolutely WRONG, one phase "missing" .









When you start to accept for valid, erroneous data, no wonder then assigned properties and nonexistent fantastic real objects.

PROVE IT

 

[HomerBB]

The world was flat, until . . .
Ships made of iron could not float, until . . .
Heavier than air flight was impossible, until . . .

folks get stuck with what they have heard for so long the rest of the world leaves them behind.

 

[gt40425hp]

The Sirio Vector 4000 like the Sigma 4 can be secured at the middle of the radiator by using dacron guy rope. Many Ham verticals antennas that are not much longer than the Sigma 4 are secured in the same way, as this is a common issue.

ive considered that but i always found my self never being able to have a way to install them properly ether due to size limitations or property lines

 

[Lil'Yeshua]

The Sirio Vector 4000 like the Sigma 4 can be secured at the middle of the radiator by using dacron guy rope. Many Ham verticals antennas that are not much longer than the Sigma 4 are secured in the same way, as this is a common issue.

I was thinking about doing the same thing with my Vector 4000 whenever I put it up. They make 'forest green' Dacron?

 

[The DB]

CEBIK id dead?? R.I.P.

I'm wasting my time on people who do not want to learn.

In a round about way you are correct. You are wasting your time on people, but not people who need to learn. The learner here needs to be you.

All of the information you are presenting has been discussed at length here on this forum, and anyone who takes the time to read that information, and optionally confirm it elsewhere, will find it is very good information.

A point to look at and reconsider your position. As was clearly shown (by me in the other thread using J-pole models), full cancellation of an RF signal cannot take place in the real world because such full cancellation requires both elements to be in the same physical space. This is an absolute fact and something you clearly don't agree with.

Something else to consider, the upward pointing set of radials doesn't act exactly like a set of horizontal radials, nor do they act exactly like the shielding of a coax cable. The reality is they act like something in between. One thing both a set of radials and the shielding in a coax cable do is resist the passage of RF energy from one side to the other. In this antenna design this leads to the out of phase radiation of RF that takes place within the set of upward pointing radials to effectively be trapped inside those radials, thus very little if any radiates beyond said radials and does not need to be canceled, thus your basket cancellation theory is wrong in yet another way. Further, as little to no cancellation is actually taking place outside of the cone, there is even more of the in phase RF being radiated by the cone. Oh wait, you seem to eroniously believe that this RF is also out of phase with the upper vertical element. If that is the case then how does your cancellation theory work when it is in phase with the portion of vertical element underneath it is supposedly canceling?

I've recently read through all of your arguments in both this thread and the one the discussion with you about the Vector began. Some of your arguments are contradictory with other arguments that you have made. You have contradicted earlier arguments you have made more than once.

I hope one day you realize how much you don't know. The only thing I can suggest for you to see how this antenna actually works is to tell you to build it yourself. Don't be afraid to make some adjustments to the overall length and basket dimensions, and test it yourself. As you said you got part of your experience by building antennas, I'm asking you to do nothing more than what you claim to to have done already.


The DB

 

[nosepc]

In a round about way you are correct. You are wasting your time on people, but not people who need to learn. The learner here needs to be you.

All of the information you are presenting has been discussed at length here on this forum, and anyone who takes the time to read that information, and optionally confirm it elsewhere, will find it is very good information.

A point to look at and reconsider your position. As was clearly shown (by me in the other thread using J-pole models), full cancellation of an RF signal cannot take place in the real world because such full cancellation requires both elements to be in the same physical space. This is an absolute fact and something you clearly don't agree with.

Something else to consider, the upward pointing set of radials doesn't act exactly like a set of horizontal radials, nor do they act exactly like the shielding of a coax cable. The reality is they act like something in between. One thing both a set of radials and the shielding in a coax cable do is resist the passage of RF energy from one side to the other. In this antenna design this leads to the out of phase radiation of RF that takes place within the set of upward pointing radials to effectively be trapped inside those radials, thus very little if any radiates beyond said radials and does not need to be canceled, thus your basket cancellation theory is wrong in yet another way. Further, as little to no cancellation is actually taking place outside of the cone, there is even more of the in phase RF being radiated by the cone. Oh wait, you seem to eroniously believe that this RF is also out of phase with the upper vertical element. If that is the case then how does your cancellation theory work when it is in phase with the portion of vertical element underneath it is supposedly canceling?

I've recently read through all of your arguments in both this thread and the one the discussion with you about the Vector began. Some of your arguments are contradictory with other arguments that you have made. You have contradicted earlier arguments you have made more than once.

I hope one day you realize how much you don't know. The only thing I can suggest for you to see how this antenna actually works is to tell you to build it yourself. Don't be afraid to make some adjustments to the overall length and basket dimensions, and test it yourself. As you said you got part of your experience by building antennas, I'm asking you to do nothing more than what you claim to to have done already.


The DB

You look like a preacher.

just words and more words.

Can not refute a single argument of my past writings.
And they are very simple, for that reason only uses words, since not help or math, or models, or diagrams, or drawings made ​​falsely.

Just words like a preacher.

Many says.
"I really goes well with the VECTOR 4000.* I PUT 2000 WATTS and make contact with everyone."

But I want to see them making contacts with 148GTL COBRA and that antenna!

If I have power, I just one Firestik home made to talk to everyone.

With a Firestk I've communicated with Spain, and throughout Central America with Cobra 148GTL.(12Watts)

All antenna radiates better or more so, but many confuse their property with their advantages in the installation, the VECTOR 4000 has the advantage of being big and your users are using smaller masts, and there may be its only advantage, which is not its design, which in any case is outdone by GM for that matter.
I agree that is a skeleton type antenna, but I not agree that produce gains of up to 3 dB more than just a quarter-wave vertical element alone.
prove it.

 

[The DB]

You look like a preacher.

just words and more words.

Can not refute a single argument of my past writings.
And they are very simple, for that reason only uses words, since not help or math, or models, or diagrams, or drawings made ​​falsely.

Just words like a preacher.

Just so you know, a good friend of mine is a preacher. He preaches what he knows about. He is a good man and a good friend. Given what I know of preachers I'm not sure if you are complimenting me or insulting him...

Also, there are more to words than just being words. Ever hear the saying that someone looked intelligent until they opened their mouth? Especially in a forum environment such as this words are all I have to go on to make a judgement on someone. Your words actually say quite a lot about you. I'm warning you about this now because your words are not helping you or your argument. It takes more than being accurate. Everything you are, I'm going to use the word complaining, about you are guilty of yourself.

As I said before, I was once at the point you are now, then I learned more. Unfortunately you choose to be stuck where you currently are. I clearly demonstrated that one of the concepts you have mentioned multiple times was wrong in the other thread, including some 4nec2 models that also confirm this data. I guess that is what being a "preacher" is, demonstrating you are wrong... You promptly ignored it. When it came to the interaction between us specifically it is you who chose to throw out evidence you apparently didn't agree with. That is also not the only time you have done that over these two threads.

I was going to ask you a question here, but instead have decided that I'm done with this conversation. Lucky you, it was a trick question that no matter how you answered you would be in disagreement with something you have already said...

One last observation before I go, you once made the claim that you learned by building antennas. I challenge you to build this antenna and see what is happening for yourself...

The DB, monitoring. op:


The DB

 

[Lil'Yeshua]

“If you think you're leading and no one is following you, then you're only taking a walk.”

 

[Shockwave]

We got the truth when he came in here and claimed to be a new ham wanting to learn. This is NOT someone in a position to teach others. That combined with every post he's made should be considered as a warning to anyone who is really trying to learn. DON'T BOTHER TO READ A WORD.

You can only be confused by his posts because they contain no accuracy and are based on free software that consistently demonstrates an inability to simulate the design and absolutely no first hand experience working with the design to form his own ideas.

What you have here is a wrong opinion that was given to him from someone else that had no clue. Without the knowledge to form his own conclusion he has become a parrot for another with no ability to discern right from wrong. This mentality believes only what he hears first and ignores any variations that may come to light later.

On another note, some of those pictures he wastes time making are sort of amusing. Mickey Mouse with a wand got a chuckle out of me. The bright side is if we also temporarily regress, we can enjoy the pictures and ignore the words without missing a thing. Like we did as children.

PS: I wonder if he thinks the "short poles" I install some of these antennas on should be considered in his opinion? Some are installed more than 1000 feet above ground level. Guess what? They still outperform those unity gain 1/2 waves with ease every single day.

 

[nosepc]

"guy told me .."
"tests already showed in 4nec2"

I see no evidence, just words.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

On another note, some of those pictures he wastes time making are sort of amusing. Mickey Mouse with a wand got a chuckle out of me. The bright side is if we also temporarily regress, we can enjoy the pictures and ignore the words without missing a thing. Like we did as children.

Agreed about the pictures. Still trying to figure out WTF the latest one has to do with the discussion at hand.

"guy told me .."
"tests already showed in 4nec2"

I see no evidence, just words.

One could say the exact same thing about your posts. It's hard to see the evidence when you completely ignore the evidence.