Put up a Hustler 5BTV today

[Captain Kilowatt]

Wrong!

By itself it won't work well on 80 but it will work on 40.

Again, for 80 meters and below it requires an UNUN near the tuner to bring the impedances to a value that a remote tuner can handle.

The DB explained it well and seems appropriate why these are 43ft, I suspect you really didn't know why.

Oh FFS man........ When I said it will work well on 80m and likely on 40m I was talking about the radiated RF field and the angle of it regardless or what you need to attach to the feedpont of it. For that matter it won't work at all on ANY band because you need to attach a tuner to the base of it. There I covered that possible misunderstanding. Also YES I DID in fact know that the length was something that would not be a half wavelength on any band. A few simple and quick clicks of a calculator shows that. 43 foot antennas are nothing new and there is a reason doublets are ofetn around 86-88 feet long and NOT a full size 80m dipole fed with ladderline on all bands. The impedance goes nuts on some bands but when the doublet is around 86-88 feet things calm down. I ran one until last year when it broke. It started as an 80m dipole and finished as an 88 foot doublet that the tuner could handle.

I never used these antennas but I considered one when I was looking for a single antenna for multiband operation. I did read up and learn about them but determined it wouldn't work at my location because I didn't have room for all the radials.

Any vertical requires radials even a decent inverted L which is essentially a vertical radiator with top loading.

I'm not knocking what you put up at your location, but I think your taking it personally that I am.

Sure sounds like it.

I simply asked a direct question earlier because I often heard you speak out against the 43 ft antennas.

And I do so for the previously mentioned reasons regarding radiation angles. If I want decent radiation angles on all bands I will either have to use in order of preference, a single antenna of adjustable height, several different antennas or different heights, or a trapped antenna that isolates the unused portion of the antenna. As for being inefficient due to being short, remember that even a small magnetic loop antenna can be VERY effective and very efficient. It just has poor bandwidth.

 

[kopcicle]

"but RARELY are they ever 1/2 wavelength especially on the low end of the band." ~CK
Simple, that one. The voltages present at any matching network climb drastically when attempting to match a 180 degree radiator. Like needing a vacuum cap for anything over 200 watts .
I know my SG-230 doesn't like 1/2 waves. It would rather tune a wet string than a 1/2 wave.
Now I suppose someone will want to see the math. Go fish

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

"but RARELY are they ever 1/2 wavelength especially on the low end of the band." ~CK
Simple, that one. The voltages present at any matching network climb drastically when attempting to match a 180 degree radiator. Like needing a vacuum cap for anything over 200 watts .
I know my SG-230 doesn't like 1/2 waves. It would rather tune a wet string than a 1/2 wave.
Now I suppose someone will want to see the math. Go fish

Well there is that reason but also it is easier to get forward gain using a phased array with shorter towers that low in frequency. AM stations are strictly regulated when it comes to allowable field strength crossing the border. I had a station, CKDY, that was in Digby N.S. right on the south-west coast. We had to use two towers with an extremely tight pattern. TX was 1Kw and five miles out the back you could hardly hear the station but 40 miles in the opposite direction it was stronger than 5 miles out the back. This was necessary to protect a co-channel station in Quebec via skywave and also a station in Massachusetts via groundwave due to proximity to salt water. Higher gain antennas would have made it very hard to meet the signal strength requirements out the back and sides.

 

[2RT307]

Oy, after reading all this, my head has started to hurt. Captain K, I'd like to suggest that after all the work you put into putting up your vertical that you keep it permanently. Seems to me, the more antennas the better. I have 3 at my QTH, a 40 meter loop, an end fed random wire, and a 10 meter dipole. Sometimes one will receive better than the other, and one will transmit better than the other. Oddly enough, the 10 meter dipole lets me hear things on 40 and 20 due to it attenuating a ton of noise, so sometimes I use it to receive an in the noise station. I have them all on a switch, and use the best combination to make a QSO. That Hustler vertical might be a nice weapon to keep in the arsenal!

73,
Brett

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

Oy, after reading all this, my head has started to hurt. Captain K, I'd like to suggest that after all the work you put into putting up your vertical that you keep it permanently. Seems to me, the more antennas the better. I have 3 at my QTH, a 40 meter loop, an end fed random wire, and a 10 meter dipole. Sometimes one will receive better than the other, and one will transmit better than the other. Oddly enough, the 10 meter dipole lets me hear things on 40 and 20 due to it attenuating a ton of noise, so sometimes I use it to receive an in the noise station. I have them all on a switch, and use the best combination to make a QSO. That Hustler vertical might be a nice weapon to keep in the arsenal!

73,
Brett

SSHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! Don't tell the wife but that is part of my grand plan. If it really were a temporary antenna I would not have put that much work into the ground system and just laid out a dozen or so and not worried about pinning them down.

 

[2RT307]

SSHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! Don't tell the wife but that is part of my grand plan. If it really were a temporary antenna I would not have put that much work into the ground system and just laid out a dozen or so and not worried about pinning them down.

Well, I was thinking that when I saw your ground setup, but didn't want to assume. For sure, I won't tell your wife. lol... I have to be pretty sneaky with my radio stuff, too.

73,
Brett

 

[Grogan]

Ok so the tower is up 40' hazer to crank the antenna up an down to service. Mast is 10' and on top 4 element Maco on the flat side. and last Saturday pu an Imax 2000 on top. An now I bought a 5BTV also with the bracket for the pl-259 conector. Capt. question did you the copper ss-30 jetlube or is the nickle standara anti-size ok.or nothing at all. was going to make my own radial plate I have aluminum angle or diamond plate ok or wait for stainless does it matter.also hardware dont have stainless screws might go with steel zink coated etc would it matter all that much. your looks real nice. got to add some stugg to the list for guy wires to should have that laying around too. thanks

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

I would go with all stainless. Aluminum will corrode in contact with the ground and zinc plated hardware WILL eventually rust. All that is BAD juju when an RF field is concerned as it could lead to lots of RFI as a worst case or as a best case poor antenna performance. I did not use tye copper anti seize on the aluminum antenna sections and used NOALOX instead. Just something about copper flakes and aluminum does not sir well with me dispite DX Engineering recommending it. Other sites I have seen including a retailer of it said not to use it on aluminum. I did use a copper based anti seize on the stainless hardware however.

 

[Grogan]

good sound advice, got to make a list and start on this project soon.

 

[Grogan]

My antenna is still in the box. I now have everything to put it up, I made the stainless ground plate myself,etc but was interested in you results and how yours is performing? Thanks

 

[wavrider]

Grogan looks good.
Only thing I will recommend, and recommendation only
Is to secure your coax using either zip ties UV resistant type or some other form of tie.
My QTH is in Florida and we get some high winds from storms, any loose hanging coax catches the wind and makes it a nightmare on connections..

So I over do it with zip ties and securing coax to mast pipes or booms.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

My antenna is still in the box. I now have everything to put it up, I made the stainless ground plate myself,etc but was interested in you results and how yours is performing? Thanks

So far so good but I have not been too active due to work. It works VERY well on 40m as I have 36 radials each 33 feet long making them a 1/4 wavelength long on that band. I get good signal reports throughout North America as well as several contacts into Europe with it. On 80m it is narrow banded and sometimes it works as good or better than my 80m dipole which is 60 feet in the middle dropping to 40 feet on one end and about 30 feet on the other end. usually it is the longer contacts that it outperforms the dipole which is to be expected due to the lower radiation angle. I worked a couple USA stations on 17m today and got a 59 report FWIW. I can't compete too well in pileups but A41NNN was heard 4x8 yesterday on 40 as well as a VQ9 but he was rough copy but nevertheless was heard. My 100 watts doe not stand a chance even if I had a yagi when those stations appear on the band. I hope to try it out some more in the next couple weeks.

 

[firerunner]

Good to hear the antenna is working for you CK. I have thought of getting to attach to the hitch on my Motorhome after talking with a guy that was doing that on his MH and had a great signal. He didn't use radials just the MH. Keep us updated on it if you would.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

Good to hear the antenna is working for you CK. I have thought of getting to attach to the hitch on my Motorhome after talking with a guy that was doing that on his MH and had a great signal. He didn't use radials just the MH. Keep us updated on it if you would.

Will do. It is getting busy here now with the holidays coming up next month but I have some vacation time +/- Christmas so I plan to make use of the free time to further evaluate the performance of it.

 

[338_MtRushmore]

Good to hear the antenna is working for you CK. I have thought of getting to attach to the hitch on my Motorhome after talking with a guy that was doing that on his MH and had a great signal. He didn't use radials just the MH. Keep us updated on it if you would.

Any details on his install? I have thought about trying some sort of vertical. This end fed seems to be working ok, but I don't see myself stringing it out when it gets cold.