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Suggestions on who to tune my Galaxy 98VHP

Ive got a basic knowledge of electronics, and I understand somewhat of how it works, but I dont have any experience at etching. Most of my experience was from building projects using breadboards for my circuits 1 class in college :)

Where can I start learning? any good web resources? and where can I buy the kits/ pre etched boards?
 
WOW! thanks freecell! I will probably be hammering your inbox after reading all this info!!

I have always loved electronics, and now that I have settled down a little bit from my younger days, I am wanting to start learning more. I wish I had payed more attention to the classwork instead of the girls in college :)

Seriously though, I am working on building a "work bench" in my garage for me to tinker with electronics. What I am wanting to do is get a good set of meters, a good oscilliscope, and start learning. I have an old cobra 29 that is going to be my test subject, and I would like to build a little amp for starters.
 
After reading the explanations of amp classes, that cleared up alot of things as to why the Texas Star is such a highly praised amp as far as sound quality. Its a AB class amp.

Just to reiterate, this is what I am looking for. 4600 mentioned it would be pointless to drive a TS with my 98 cause I would have to turn it down.

Well, since the 98 does pretty darn good at "local" talking, I would like to do this:

When I am wanting to talk local, I want to be able to just switch off the Texas Star, and run the 98 at max power (200 watts). This way I could talk at local guys and just adjust the power on the 98 to whatever i needed when im talking around town.

Then, when I want to get out there at talk at distant stations, I would like to turn the 98 down, and just let the Texas Star do the work. Ideally, I would like to turn the 98 down low enough so that the TS would deadkey 700-800 and swing to whatever it needed to. From what I am understanding, this would allow both my radio and the amp to just "cruise" and nothing would be running "maxed" out, and everything would have really crisp and clean audio.

One thing I cant stand is an operator who has like 4k watts, but all you can hear is his equipment being overdriven and sounding like muffled crap. Like he is talking under a pile of blankets.


I would think that a class C amp would sound muffled and distorted due to "clipping" the waveform. So, I think i would prefer a class A or AB amp.
 
Yeah, I mis-stated that. I meant 800-900 PEP. After re-reading my post, I realize what I said.. LOL.

I stated a few posts back I was wanting to do 800-900 PEP on the TS (in reference to what the fellow at 8541 electronics was telling me).

Sorry about that.

Happy Easter!
 
After reading the explanations of amp classes, that cleared up alot of things as to why the Texas Star is such a highly praised amp as far as sound quality. Its a AB class amp.

Just to reiterate, this is what I am looking for. 4600 mentioned it would be pointless to drive a TS with my 98 cause I would have to turn it down.

Well, since the 98 does pretty darn good at "local" talking, I would like to do this:

When I am wanting to talk local, I want to be able to just switch off the Texas Star, and run the 98 at max power (200 watts). This way I could talk at local guys and just adjust the power on the 98 to whatever i needed when im talking around town.

Then, when I want to get out there at talk at distant stations, I would like to turn the 98 down, and just let the Texas Star do the work. Ideally, I would like to turn the 98 down low enough so that the TS would deadkey 700-800 and swing to whatever it needed to. From what I am understanding, this would allow both my radio and the amp to just "cruise" and nothing would be running "maxed" out, and everything would have really crisp and clean audio.

One thing I cant stand is an operator who has like 4k watts, but all you can hear is his equipment being overdriven and sounding like muffled crap. Like he is talking under a pile of blankets.


I would think that a class C amp would sound muffled and distorted due to "clipping" the waveform. So, I think i would prefer a class A or AB amp.







" I would think that a Class C amp would sound muffled and distorted due to "clipping" The waveform. So, I think I would prefer a Class A or AB amp"




I also thought that a Class C amp would sound distorted. They don't sound distorted. "Distortion" means Bleed over in lay language.

What "freecell" means by Clean sound is not the sound of the amp when on the air wave.
It's the amount of bleed over the amp does. Yes, Class C amps bleed over more than Class A and AB amps do, but they do not sound distorted. They "Class C" also perform better.

I knew a guy that had a 99 Galaxy with a 1X4 Davemade "Class C" amp then swithed to the 1X4 AB Class T/S. The Davemade got him out from Wilcox Az to beyond the NM border. The T/S I would lose him before I got to NM.

As far as dropping your 98vhp to perform with the T/S . You'll be hard pressed to get it down enough to drive that T/S without distortion and then have the high side of the radio to do the local talking you want to do.

I have no problems with freecell advice. It's spot on if you want a radio that doesn't sound big and loud. If you want a radio that sounds so clean it sounds like a stock cobra 29ltd.

But if you want a radio that gets noticed ,go the other route, because he doesn't know Jack about setting up a loud radio. "personal experience deleted".


" One thing I can't stand is an operator that has like 4k watts, but all you can hear is his equipment being overdriven and sounding like muffled crap. Like he's talking under a pile of blankets"

Yup, that's a T/S being overdriven by an export radio.

Stick to a clean radio if you want clean watts out of a T/S. Sorry to say no matter what freecell says the 98vhp on a T/S is over kill. It will not be "Clean".

I won't mention the 700-800watts dk you want, since it was a mistake.
 
from what I was thinking, they tech could adjust the power on the 98 so that when the power knob is all the way down, it would do around a 4-8 watt DK, and swing 30 or so. Then with the knob all the way up I could do the normal max on the 98VHP.

This way I wouldnt be overdriving the TS when the power knob is turned down. This way, I could watch my wattmeter as I turned up the power knob on the 98 till i get a max of 800-900 PEP from the TS. Hopefully I wouldnt be overdriving my TS, and both the radio and the amp would be operating in a good comfortable range and nothing is being ran hard.
 
also thought that a Class C amp would sound distorted. They don't sound distorted. "Distortion" means Bleed over in lay language.
What "freecell" means by Clean sound is not the sound of the amp when on the air wave.
It's the amount of bleed over the amp does


look I do not want you to think I am dogging you here, but both of these statments are are wrong. When using class C with a SSB input, it is NOT Just bleed over that is the problem.
They DO sound distorted.
At the very least there is no bias to hold the transistors were they need to be so that you do not get transient noise as the devices switch on...this is not opinion, it is fact, and has been proven time and time again.
There are hundreds of RF enginers that will tell you the same thing.
I have Run a class C amp on SSb and trust me
You CAN hear the difference.
If there was a compelling reason to NOT use A or AB bias in RF amps, non of the builders of Comerical or Ham equptment would do it.
Do some online reseasrch about AB vers Class C bias and modulated RF amps .
As far as Class C amps working better, Yes, they will provide more RF output per Amp draw used than a class A, Ab or Class B Amp, but that is not the whole story.
The Efficiency of Class-C can approach 85 %, But Linearity of the Class-C amplifier is the poorest of the classes of amplifiers.
They have to be linear.........


73
Jeff

Look Here:
http://www.qsl.net/va3iul/RF Power Amplifiers/RF_Power_Amplifiers.htm

Or




CONVERTING SOLID STATE CLASS C AMPLFIERS TO LINEAR OPERATION
Commentary by NR6CA, Methodology by W3KM

There are any number of amplifiers that are Class C. These have been designed and optimized for use with CW, FM or possibly even some of the single carrier digital modes of communications. So what if you want to use one of them for SSB use? Well a Class C amplifier simply can not be used for SSB and similar modes since extremely high levels of distortion will result. You need to use a linear amplifier that operates in Class A, Class AB1, AB2, or Class B. Of the different classes of linear operation the first one, Class A is the most linear and Class B is the least linear. What that means is an SSB signal would sound the best from a Class A amplifier and the worst out of a Class B linear. AB1 and AB2 fall in between. Conversely, Class A is the least efficient and Class B the most efficient of the typical linear modes.
Not every Class C amplifier can be converted to a high quality linear amplifier. But here is one way to do a simple conversion and stand the best chance of success. The input voltage can also be 12 VDC if that is the voltage required for your solid state amplifier. The nominal +.6 VDC would be tied into the base of the transistor through an appropriate RF choke and RF bypassing capacitors. R3 can be adjusted to set the quiescent (no RF input idling) current of the transistor. If you have two transistors in the output circuit, each one should have a separate bias circuit so you would need two of everything shown below. Adjust each transistor to the same idle current with no RF applied.

Also:

The RF signal transmitted must carry some information. In broadcasting, the information transmitted takes the form of speech or music and is called modulation. With amplitude modulation (AM), the RF carrier is varied in strength (amplitude) at a rate depending on the frequency of the sound.
[SIZE=-2]
307br0701.jpg
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2]Figure 1. In a Class A amplifier, no grid current flows until the grid goes positive. Nonlinear operation occurs when the grid current stops tracking the plate current.[/SIZE]
Regardless of where modulation of the carrier takes place, it is essential that the amplifying stage produces a clean, linearly amplified signal.
From the beginning


The earliest transmitters used amplitude modulation and this has continued in one form or another for about 100 years. It is probably the simplest method of modulation, requiring only the ability to vary the power output of an RF stage by varying the input audio signal.
In the 1930s frequency modulation (FM) was developed. It is accomplished by varying the frequency of the transmitted RF signal instead of the amplitude. Various methods of producing frequency modulation have been developed, including common mechanical and phase changing systems. Phase modulation produces the same effect in an FM receiver as frequency modulation.
The final stage of the transmitter may be directly modulated (in AM), or it receives an already modulated RF signal (FM). Many modern broadcast transmitters use solid-state modules in their power amplifier stages, however, there are still a considerable number of transmitters that continue to use vacuum tubes in their final stages. Solid-state devices provide considerable reduction in operating costs and their use provides the ability, in most cases, to change a faulty module on an operating transmitter without having to shut down.
Know the A, B, Cs


The most important characteristic of an amplifier is linearity. That is the ability of the stage to amplify all parts by the same amount so that all signals are amplified equally.
In a class A amplifier, current flows constantly and is not cut off during any part of the cycle. In a tube design, this is achieved by supplying sufficient negative bias voltage to the control grid to ensure that it never goes positive above 0V at any time in the cycle.
This means that no grid current flows and the source is not required to produce any drive power. For example, if the input signal has a 30V swing and the bias is -30V, the grid voltage would swing between -60V and 0V and no plate current would flow.
[SIZE=-2]
307br0702.jpg
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-2]Figure 2. When a Class B amplifier is heavily cutoff, the positive peaks cause grid current and plate current flow in a series of half-wave pulses.[/SIZE]
Because class A amplifiers are inherently inefficient in terms of required voltage and current, they are not generally used today in commercial broadcast transmitters. Instead, class B and class C amplifiers are common or variations of class B and class C circuits, such as a class AB amplifier.
With the introduction of pulse-duration modulation and digital operation systems, amplifiers have changed considerably, but the basic facts still apply.
The principles of amplification remain the same regardless of whether it is a tube or a solid-state amplifier. Because of the proliferation of high-power transmitters still using tubes, consider the control characteristics of a vacuum tube amplifier.
Figure 1 shows the dynamic characteristics of a triode tube amplifier. The solid line represents the plate current. The intersection of this line and the negative grid voltage axis shows the cut-off point at which the tube is so heavily negatively biased that no plate current flows. As the negative bias is decreased and passes through zero into the positive region, the plate current increases. The more steeply the plate current rises as the grid voltage becomes positive, the greater the transconductance of the tube. This controls the amplification factor. As the superimposed RF voltage is applied to the control grid, the bias becomes more negative on negative peaks and less negative on positive peaks. However the grid will never become positive so that no grid current will flow.
Differences in options


The major difference between the various classes of amplifiers in tube designs is the level of voltage applied to the power amplifier control grid. In class A, because the plate current is never cut completely off, the efficiency of a class A amplifier is low, about 30 percent, and so is the power output. Class AB operation is achieved by allowing a small amount of grid current to flow as required.
In class B operation, the control grid bias is increased so that the plate current is just at cut-off. The positive portion of the applied signal will cause plate current to flow immediately. No matter how far negative the grid goes, plate current will never flow. This type of operation requires sufficient signal voltage to drive the grid positive. The peak plate current is raised and sometimes the average plate current uses two tubes in push-pull operation. Figure 2 shows the operating characteristics. The output is a series of half waves with an efficiency of about 65 percent.
Class C operation is similar except that the control grid is biased far past cut off. Plate current only flows with high excitation and can reach saturation. Efficiency is high, around 90 percent. However, the waveform can be badly distorted in class B and C operation. Because of this, the correct load impedance must contain a resistive component to develop the required power. This is usually the input resistance of the transmission line.


This is just a small sample of what can be found with your search engine.
 
I agree, they do sound distorted in the true meaning of the word in SSB,and they don't function well in SSB mode , but In AM they sound great.

I just thought it was a waste of perfectly good loud radio to cut it's "cojones" just to run an amp that was made for a lesser radio, but with a Class C amp he could run the 98vhp to it's full potential in AM. I know most of the tech here abhor Class C amps, and are bias against them. I for one like them. You can drive them hard and they do get out better than the AB counter parts.

I would think you would agree that the 98vhp is probably not a very clean radio being that it is a two MosFet final radio running into 8 MosFets. You could clean it up some, but then when you ask for a radio check you'll get. Oh, it sound ok. Not "WoW!" now that's a loud radio.

That is why most people that run large amp stay away from this type of radio;They are inherently distorted. Distortion in. Large amounts of distortion out.






Owner of the biggest Galaxy in the World!
550-600 watts.
They also said this wasn't possible or a good idea. LOL I love my unique Galaxy radio.
 
"but with a Class C amp he could run the 98vhp to it's full potential in AM...."

not into any 8X2SC2879, regardless of the class of operation.





The T/S you stated that it would take what? 4 watts to 30 watts pep.


The Class C would take easy in the order of 25 watts to 175 watts PEP.

That's the radio on low.

Set the 98vhp to 25 dk on low to 65 dk on high. and he has exactly what he wants.

A amp that he can run his radio into and then run the radio by itself without the amp and still be loud and clear; all except SSB on the Class C, although you could still use it for SSB it just would sound distorted.


I ran a 4600turbo into a 4 pill Fatboy. with 25 watts dk. swing to 160 watts. It performed great, although I would have preferred a 6 pill Fatboy. It still performed just fine with the 4pill.

With the 8 pill it would be an awesome setup.
 
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